Right side valves sound loose after oil change

[ProductUser]

Greetings

I'm looking for some rationale from what appears to sound like loose valves on the right side (this is not the fuel injector ticking). The ticking only becomes very noticeable when the engine is fully warmed up.

I really noticed it just after my recent oil change (using Mobil 1 15-50 synthetic for the last 25k miles). The oil level is right at the red dot (3.75 quarts). There is no leakage and the oil pressure light turns off immediately after startup. The bike appears to run just fine; there is no loss of power. Idle is also perfect -- no surging.

I commute on the bike three days a week and I usually take a spirited ride on the weekend, so I'm pretty much in tune with all of its normal noises.

If it were loose valves, I would assume that I would hear this tapping/ticking when the bike is cold; this is not the case. Also, the left side does not have this loud ticking sound.

Bike specs: '04 R
40k miles
Nearly all of the services have been performed by dealer.

Thoughts before I check the valves? Or, am I just a bit too anal about these things?

Thanks,

ProductUser

[Capt. Blackadder]

It would be worth it to check the rocker arm end play, if you're going in there anyway. If that checks out, and the valves are within spec, I'd suspect the cam chain tensioner.

Then again, since I changed to 15W-50 synthetic from 20W-50 dino, I've noticed that I can "hear my motor better", so to speak... the slightly lighter oil doesn't seem to have quite the same dampening effect. The Phoenix summer heat does the Boxer motor no favors in that regard, either. It runs just fine all the same, so I'm tempted to say: Just keep riding.

[daslimpet]

I second the Cap'n.

My right side rocker end play was a little excessive last spring and it was noticeable as a consistent 'tick' 'tick' 'tick' sound after the bike was all warmed up. With the engine still cool, the thicker oil probably dampened the side to side movement to the point where it was less noticeable.

The general consensus of the board that that time was that this condition was more of an annoyance issue than an impending catastrophic failure issue, but I set it back to spec anyway and Voila! No more 'tick' 'tick'!

Hope that's all it is for you as well. Good luck!

[ProductUser]

Daslimpet and Capt.,

Thanks for the info. I do remember reading about that some time ago. I'll check the rocker end play later this week.

Tony

[Beemeridian]

88

[OU812]

Dave, that link gave me a headache.

[Boxer]

I've been putting off doing that, but I think its time now. I've started noticing a noisy right side ticking after its really hot. At least it sounds like its coming from that side. Hard to tell.

Can you repeat the sage advice from Cyclerob, or is that priviledged information? I would love to hear it.

[Beemeridian]

99

[CycleRob]

Beemeridian and I spoke on the phone and I warned him against the dangers of setting the end gaps too tight . . . . parts damage. A tight .0025" end gap could cause a galling/seizing problem at cold/hot temperature extremes. The noise diff between .0025" and .003" or .004" would be undetectable, so settle for .003" or .004".
I say "settle for" because as you tighten the carrier bolts and head nut the end gap clearance can change. Too many readjustment tightening/loosening stud stretching high torque sequences will squeeze away the oil between the threads and then they start to gall -unless- you remove the nut enough to squirt some oil on it. I set all 4 of my end gaps at .003" and allowed a tight .004".

We also discussed why the 20nm torque + 180deg turn tighter is a more accurate "stretch&load the studs" tightening method than, say, a final torque like 50ft-lbs. Yes, the studs do stretch the 1/2 thread pitch distance, like a rubber band, when you tighten the nut to spec. You feel it happening when you are swinging the breaker bar that final half turn. The torque doesn't increase that much as it keeps on turning. It's quite a sensation, compared to something like tightening the rear wheel lugnuts.

[owldaddy]

I found this thread a couple days ago, as beemeridian would say.

I can say with certainty that the valvetrain has never sounded so quiet.

It really worked for quieting the valve gear. Even my Mom had made comment about how noisy this bike had been at idle, nice and quiet now. Well worth the effort do the rocker end play adjustment, it does make a difference. I'm surprised this procedure isn't mentioned in my Clymer manual.

[CycleRob]

I cannot stress it enough about the dangers of repeatedly trying to attain the minimum .0025" or .0030" clearance. The torque specs for both the Torx carriage mount bolt and the headbolt nut are for oiled threads. You can set the clearance very close to desired by just mildly hand tightening them with tools like this:
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r87/ ... dGaps1.jpg
When it's right, THEN use the torque wrench to the initial 20 N-m + half a turn. If it's not .003" or .004" final end play on both intake and exhaust sides, you may want to do it again. If that's so, remove the Torx head carriage hold down bolt and the big nut enough to apply a few oil drops to the threads. If you just keep tightening and loosening them many times without re-oiling, the oil film will be squashed and squeezed away and full contact metal-2-metal or in the case of the Torx head bolt, metal-2-Aluminum thread contact will occur. That increased thread friction increases the final torque reading without applying the correct installation torque and may cause thread galling.

The downside of a too tight rockerarm endplay is that there isn't enough oil clearance on a very hot engine. When that happens the parts are forced to rub together, quickly generate enough heat to weld the moving/stationary parts together!! That means the valve spring will not be strong enough to close the valve after each powerful camlobe opening. Then BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM-BAM . . . . (until you turn the key or killswitch off) . . . the piston keeps hitting it! It usually breaks off the valve head tulip and continues to bang it around the cylinder, doing a great deal of damage before you even begin to reach for the kill switch. FYI:
INTAKE VALVE 11341342016 $57.95 +core
EXHAUST VALVE 11341342017 $151.15 +core
ROCKER ARM 11331340265 $143.68 +core
LEFT CAMSHAFT SUPPORTING BRACKET 11337670599 $234.52 +core
Piston, anti-bluesmoke 11257652663 $445.57 +core

Plus gaskets, other parts, etc.
That price is each. Installation is a lot extra. You have been warned.

[OU812]

Oh Rob, thank you for saving us all from these damn oilheads!
No really, Thanks!