How out of line is this?

[Northerner]

We've had so many beautiful early spring rides up here, I've sat on this question for a month, not wanting to spoil the mood. But I'm prompted to share some dirty linen relating to my local dealer, in the hope some good comes of it. As you'll see, this is pretty small potatoes, but I'd be interested in what others think.

Dealer called late winter, offering to pick up my 2007 R1200R for free and do three service recall campaigns: steering damper, antenna ring and brake lines. Great, and I figure the least I can do is throw some money their way so I asked them to change the oil and brake fluid too. The bike come back with a bill for $237.60, including 8% NY sales tax. How out of line is this? I won't itemize it all here - unless someone is curious - but they charged 1 1/2 hrs. labor @75 just for the brake fluid change, and the oil change with filter and labor came to $88, plus tax.

I've been buying and riding BMW's for over 30 years, and always been glad to pay full retail to support the dealer network, without which we couldn't enjoy these fine bikes. I'm certainly not one of those who begrudge them a profit. But this last bill has me scratching my head a bit. Any comments?

While I'm at it, as a long-time occasional lurker, I'd like to give a big thanks to Doug, Don E, ChiTown and the many, many others who make this such a helpful board!

[NakedRider]

I haven't done the brakes on this bike yet but $88 for an oil change seems way too high.

[Stef.]

Can't comment on this as I will be picking up my bike tomorrow and it is my first BMW. (BMW R1200R - 2010) I have to admit though that looking through this forum at other threads, I am slightly worried about the upcoming costs re my new bike. I guess you have to pay a lot for the name... Also, apparently with other brands the first service is usually free- not so with BMW. I hope I will be as lucky as I was with all my Hondas.
Stef.

[waynemathews]

I was charged $174 for an oil change and brake fluid replacement last month, 1.5 hours labor. Didn't strike me as unreasonable. They also mounted Ohlins shocks at the same time, another 1.5 hours labor. its amazing how much smoother the roads are now.

The first service was $340, and I was happy that that was less than the first service on my '06 Buell ($367).

None of these are difficult to do yourself, although when I do it myself it takes longer. Motorcycle maintenance is generally more expensive than automobile maintenance. For some perspective, the last oil change on my airplane (now sold) was $225.

[dumfounded]

None of these are difficult to do yourself, although when I do it myself it takes longer.

I agree! When I first bought my R12RT, I took the money I would have spent on the first service and invested in the specialty tools I needed to do my own service, including the GS-911 diagnostic tool. I sold the RT and purchased an R and of course the tools are the same. Now I just have to pay for oil, filters, and a few hours of my own time to service my bike.

Join the BMW-MOA and head over to their website to get some great DIY guides (with pictures!) for every service you need to do, or purchase an instructional DVD from another source.
Go here to download the service schedules: http://www.ascycles.com/bmw_motorcycle_ ... dules.aspx.
Enjoy your motorcycle even more knowing you've built a stronger bond with the machine.

Now if only newer Mercedes were so simple, I'd have it made!

[tinytrains]

I guess I should appreciate my dealer more. My 600 mile service was only $220. That is the lowest I have seen posted.

Scott

[celticus]

I don’t know about New York State. You might ask Eliot Spitzer what a good screwing in NY regularly goes for. Your bill seems a tad high to me though.

Mark

[fastdogs2]

My invoice for the 600 mile service on my R1200R does not list hours for the labor, but here is the breakout from the invoice:

Parts - $128.48 4 gaskets, 4 qts oil, 1 gear oil 1 oil filter
Shop Supplies - $6.25
Labor - $125.00

Total of the above - $259.73
Tax - $9.96

Total - $269.69

Bill

[deilenberger]

You were screwed on the brake fluid flush.

I'd ask them what the book rate for the fluid flush is. If they're using the book rate for the older power assisted brakes (aka Servo) - then 1.5 hours is a reasonable charge. The newer brakes that we have are nowhere NEAR that complex or time consuming to flush. Thing is - the front circuit flush should have been paid for by BMW since you were getting the recall done for the brake line. Even if you were paying for the entire flush (which you shouldn't have been) - the labor shouldn't have been more than 1 hour. I can do it in about 45 minutes while show/telling a crowd (and changing brake pads) at a local club tech session.. soooo..

If this dealer is MAX-BMW, call and ask to talk to Max (I think he is at the NH store..) From what I've heard and seen - he appears to be a square dealer. If you ask right - like why were you charged for labor that BMW was picking up the tab for - I suspect you'll get a response you'll find satisfactory. If it wasn't Max's - and it was someplace like BMW of Manhattan - well - that's a company store, and I'd bet contacting customer relations at BMW-Motorad might resolve the issue.

[Northerner]

Many thanks for all the helpful responses. Don, that's great information to have. I will contact the service manager and ask about their book rate for the brake fluid flush, as well as whether the front would have been part of the brake line recall work. I'd been wondering about that. I will share what their response is. Thanks again.

[Northerner]

FWIW, here's the email response I got from the service manager regarding these questions:

We normally get approx 2.0 hrs labor to flush and bleed the entire brake system on your bike. When we do the brake line conversion we do not flush and bleed the entire system. We just change the lines, add fluid and bleed. That is what warranty pays for.

Thanks, Tony MAX BMW NY

[celticus]

Northerner, $ 237.60 might not that much for an education. Doing your brakes on this bike is not that hard. I would not say that it is not fun as a matter of fact.
Buy the speed bleeders.
Mark

by celticus » Sun Oct 18, 2009 12:05 pm

I flushed my brake fluid yesterday with the help of Don Eilenberger's pictorial from the BMWMOA hexhead forum.
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/showthread.php?t=38825.
It is not a difficult project but it was helpful to read through the tech forum and gather parts/supplies before starting.
I followed Dons advice and had three Speed Bleeders here ready to install when I began. The Speed Bleeders make the job go a lot quicker! They are a great addition to the bike.
My old fluid was not quite as ugly as the fluid shown in Don's picture but it was definitely darker than the nice clean stuff I replaced it with.
I used Prestone synthetic Dot 4. I used almost every shop rag I own trying to keep the brake fluid both old and new off of my bike and the garage floor.
I used a home made brake fluid collection bottle with a tube in the lid to collect the old dirty stuff. If not for the special bottle I'll bet I'd have spilled the bottle several times.
There is a lot of helpful information in the MOA Hexhead DIY / Tech Library
http://www.bmwmoa.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=44
Once again give the Speed Bleeders serious thought and Thanks Don. The photos in the article were top not notch.

[hjsbmw]

We normally get approx 2.0 hrs labor to flush and bleed the entire brake system on your bike.

It took me about that doing this the first time ever, walking on eggshells, looking closely at all parts, and also swapping the bleeder nipples for speed bleeders. Don't know if it should take an experienced mechanic that long.

As far as the $80 oil change is concerned, a DIY oil change ran me about $50, using an OEM filter and 4 quarts of BMW non-synthetic 20/50. I don't know what a dealer usually charges for labor, disposal fee, taxes,...

Be that as it may, I wouldn't feel bad about it, but would take it as an impulse to look into doing at least some of this work myself. Most of the routine maintenance on these bikes is absolutely doable and worthwhile learning, a) to save, b) because it is fun, and c) for someone who has a computer job, such as myself, doing tactile work with immediate results is gratifying in a priceless way.

[thepeacebullgrunt]

So far I found a nice & experienced former BMW mechanic which now work in his personal garage... when I should pay $800 I pay $280

You have to be patient... show up very early morning or give him your bike for few days.

Its in Venice beach and I can PM his references for those interested.

[TAL2GK]

So where can we find independent BMW motorcycle mechanics? Its easy to find BMW mechanics for cars, but I haven't had any luck with bikes. I'm going in for my 600-mile service tomorrow and believe the charge is in the neighborhood of $450!

[waynemathews]

So where can we find independent BMW motorcycle mechanics? Its easy to find BMW mechanics for cars, but I haven't had any luck with bikes. I'm going in for my 600-mile service tomorrow and believe the charge is in the neighborhood of $450!

If you don't mind a 200 mile ride, Boxerworks in Watkinsville, Ga is a great independent shop (http://www.boxerworks-service.com/).

To find something closer you might try the Carolina BMW Owners Group http://www.carolinasbmwmoa.org/.

Wayne

[TAL2GK]

Well, I was WAY off in my earlier number ... and for a change, in my benefit.

I remember seeing mid-$400's quoted as my 600-mile service when I was being sold a service plan (which I declined). Thankfully, the actual cost was significantly less. My 600-mile service included parts totalling $112 and labor of 1 3/4 hours for $150 more, so my total after shop supplies are added in was $274. So, not cheap, by any means, but less than I initially feared.

[deilenberger]

Mine, back in 2007 - I included in the purchase price of the bike so I wouldn't hear SWMBO commenting on it needing $$ service so soon after purchase (about a week actually after I rode out, I rode back in for the 600 mile service..) was $275 - negotiated as part of the deal.

[celticus]

So where can we find independent BMW motorcycle mechanics? Its easy to find BMW mechanics for cars, but I haven't had any luck with bikes. I'm going in for my 600-mile service tomorrow and believe the charge is in the neighborhood of $450!

If you don't mind a 200 mile ride, Boxerworks in Watkinsville, Ga is a great independent shop (http://www.boxerworks-service.com/).



Wayne

Nathan and Dear at Boxerworks are a couple of great guys who know what they are doing. 200miles IS a long way but they have a great shop.
They might give you some options the BMW dealerships would never dream of.

Mark