BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

After purchasing my 08 R1200R I asked the dealer about a tire press. retro fit. I was told that the sensors & control unit were readily available and reasonablly priced and the install would be simple. The only problem is the dealers can not get the necessary software from BMW to make it work. I called BMW directly and got the same uncooperative response. This is from the same folks that lost my bike in shipping for weeks and tried to blame it on the dealer and the same folks who tell us that it's "normal" for the bike not to go into first when it's cold. The R1200R overall ( quirks included) is a really nice bike. The only shame is that we had to buy it from a company that has much to learn about customer satisfaction. I just bought another bike and it was.......a Honda VFR. I will never buy another bike, no matter how good they are, from BMW.

That's a shame since there are aftermarket TPM kits that work well. Somewhere I have a thread about installing one on mine. I also suspect since BMW has changed policy on the DSC system (same problem - can get parts, no activation code) and is now selling the code to activate it - there is hope for the factory TPM.

Does the Honda you bought have a TPM system? Just curious..

and the same folks who tell us that it's "normal" for the bike not to go into first when it's cold.

It's really not a deal-breaker, unless you can't do the following:

- roll the bike a bit

or

- let out the clutch a bit

or

- pull in the clutch & IMMEDIATELY tap it into gear (works great, thanks Don!)

If you want to ride an appliance, that's your perogative. Honda builds great generators, lawnmowers and motorcycles, I just don't find them all that stirring. (well, there are a couple of exceptions...).

I think the reason BMW is 'uncoorperative' is because they would face a pretty serious litigation problem fitting safety devices to bikes that were never destined to have them, in the event they failed.

My 2¢

I think the reason BMW is 'uncoorperative' is because they would face a pretty serious litigation problem fitting safety devices to bikes that were never destined to have them, in the event they failed.

It could run the other way as well ... manufacturers have gotten sued for not putting then-optional safety gear on all of their vehicles as soon as it was available. ISTR this was the case with automotive airbags ... now ubiquitous, originally an optional item. It's becoming the same way with ABS, for that matter.

Anyway, if they could retrofit, then they could have put it on at the factory, and... Et cetera.

Best,

- Lewellen

And from talking to someone knowledgeable - the big reason BMW changed policy on the DSC system was so dealers could add it to bikes in the showrooms that weren't factory equipped. It helps them market bikes that weren't equipped with the option from the factory.

Motorcyclist treks 18,000 miles from Brazil to D.C. to seek recognition for a device he created.

Vieira, a lifelong tinkerer, developed a device in the mid-1990s that detects low tire pressure in vehicles and alerts drivers with an alarm. He registered a patent for it in Brazil in 1999. Since then, he has waged a battle for international validation of his rights as the inventor, particularly in the United States, where a similar accessory is made under a U.S. patent. His goal is to open a factory in Brazil to produce the alarm. . . . The patent fight led him to leave Campinas on June 25 for Brasília, where he hoped his government could solve his problem. But after several fruitless days sparring with bureaucrats, Vieira decided there was only one place to go: Washington.

He did not ride an R1200R.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 02210.html

Wow! Props to him, for riding a 150cc bike from Brazil to Washington. Probably faces a (very) uphill battle, but I wish him luck.

I've been using the pull in the clutch all the way and let it out some to get it into first trick. It works, but that's not the point. Obviously something is wrong if we need to go through all these rituals. For BMW to deny there is a problem and refuse to do anything to fix it is an insult given what we paid for these bikes. On the subject of retro fits....If BMW was concerned about litigation then why sell handguards ( of any type) which have already caused issues with getting tangled in the controls. I think the real reason they are not willing to supply software upgrades is that they haven't figured out how they can get paid for them and keep the dealers from using the software repeatedly without payment. In any case this is foolish on their part. They are loosing a potentially large source of revenue. Obviously the European & Japanese manufacturers haven't figured out what Harley has: there are huge profits to be had from accessories. To the gentleman that referred to Honda as a "appliances", I can only assume you have never ridden a late model VFR. It's been around 27 years and has been rated the "best all around motorcycle" by many members of the press. I read a quote by a motorcycle Police Officer who rides a R1200RT for "work" and , by choice, hops on his VFR for his commute home. I'd like to make one final comment about the R1200R. If everyone on this forum is really honest with themselves and each other, there is one overriding theme though out much of what's been written. Although we love these bikes we are constantly trying to make them more comfortable. Look at how much has been written on the windshield. Then there are risers, seats, location of controls,etc. The bottom line is that many of us are trying to make these bikes into Sport Touring bikes. I'm not sure what that means. Did we buy the wrong bike to begin with? Maybe we should have gotten a R1200RT or a ST1300 or an FJR. Maybe it just says that we basically like the bike but there is room for improvement. If BMW marketing was smart they'd get on this forum and others like it and LISTEN to the folks that actually spent the bucks.

builtforcomfort wrote:... Did we buy the wrong bike to begin with? Maybe we should have gotten a R1200RT or a ST1300 or an FJR...

Each individual will have to make that decision for themselves...

I'm sure I bought the bike I wanted.

builtforcomfort wrote:I think the real reason they are not willing to supply software upgrades is that they haven't figured out how they can get paid for them and keep the dealers from using the software repeatedly without payment.

Actually - they figured that out just fine. In order to retrofit things like the TPM (not available - yet - as a retrofit) or the DSC (which now is available as a retrofit) - the dealer has to purchase an activation code from BMW, and that code is keyed to your VIN# - and the modules in the bike know what your VIN# is. They are certain to get paid for this because otherwise your hardware just won't work.

If BMW marketing was smart they'd get on this forum and others like it and LISTEN to the folks that actually spent the bucks.

Well - in that case - BMW marketing is smart. I can promise you they DO monitor the larger BMW forums, both car and bike. It's done at BMW-NA headquarters for the US and Canada, and in Germany for Yurop. There is a full time staff that does nothing but that.

BMW isn't dumb - this is the cheapest information source they could find. And occasionally - people have been contacted by BMW if there was a problem that wasn't resolved correctly - very quietly, sometimes with a non-disclosure agreement - but it does and has happened.

builtforcomfort wrote: I'd like to make one final comment about the R1200R. If everyone on this forum is really honest with themselves and each other, there is one overriding theme though out much of what's been written. Although we love these bikes we are constantly trying to make them more comfortable. Look at how much has been written on the windshield. Then there are risers, seats, location of controls,etc. The bottom line is that many of us are trying to make these bikes into Sport Touring bikes. Did we buy the wrong bike to begin with? Maybe we should have gotten a R1200RT or a ST1300 or an FJR. .

My Two Cents on that. This bike is a throw back to the bikes of the 70s and 80s when you bought a bike and modified it into exactly what you wanted. Bikes have developed into very use specific machines, then the the street fighter/urban bike came along. WOW what a great idea, a bike with a frame,two wheels, a tank, and an engine (OK a few other things).

Most of the people on this list appear to be closer to their last bike ride than they are to their first ride and have very specific ideas of what they require in a motorcycle. The R1200R affords them the platform to build what they want. Some want a dirt road bike,some a light touring bike, some are into the custom look pretty thing, all easily accomplished with this bike. Some even use it as an urban go back and forth to work bike - the official purpose.

I'm looking for a light touring bike,with some weather protection, that I can run down a dirt road or through some mud and still be able to pick it up when it goes down, but when I clean it up I want it to be pretty. I also don't want to go to a rally and see twenty bikes just like mine lined up handlebar to handlebar. An RT/ST/GT or GS wouldn't do that for me, I wouldn't trade my R for two anythings unless I could sell them.

I don't see nearly enough customizing on this forum, not by a long shot. I'd like to see some ape hangers personally. Dual headlights like on Triumph's Speed Triple. An R1200R with "S" wheels. Side cars. Performance cam gears. An R with GS or RT or ST instrument panel. An R with S underseat exhausts. The "S" guys over at the Pelican Site know how to mix it up if you ask me and we could learn a thing or two from them. I bought a naked bike with lots of open avenues to customization.
Hulk has headache
I don't know what got into me.

Mark

I think that making a motorcycle fit your body better with the things mentioned is part of motorcycling, no matter what make or model you have. Not many bikes have tilt/telescoping steering,eight way adjustable seats, adjustable control pedals, and climate control like most autos have. Motorcycles will never be perfect, but certain models feel better to certain people. I for one was turned off by the vfr with its noisy valve train, cramped seating, generic suspension, chain drive and $1000 valve adjustments. Not to mention the lack of character and it just looks like any other crotch rocket on the road....btw did honda ever help their customers with that nasty death wobble the latest vfr 800 have built in to them ?? You should hear the bitch'n the goldwing guys do about their bikes too.

I don't know about the "noisey Valve train" my VFR is MUCH quieter than the BMW and MUCH smoother. That being said, Honda, as a company, is no prize either.

What I'm saying is that we should not let these manufacturers ( BMW, Honda or whoever ) off the hook. If you don't hold their feet to the fire they will continue to weasel out of their responsibility to correct their mistakes. We're all human and we all make mistakes but we need to be accountable.

What about this "death wobble" with the VFR ?

builtforcomfort wrote:I don't know about the "noisey Valve train" my VFR is MUCH quieter than the BMW and MUCH smoother. That being said, Honda, as a company, is no prize either.

What I'm saying is that we should not let these manufacturers ( BMW, Honda or whoever ) off the hook. If you don't hold their feet to the fire they will continue to weasel out of their responsibility to correct their mistakes. We're all human and we all make mistakes but we need to be accountable.

Sounds like you're on a "mission" here.. your other thread sorta confirms this.

Question - why did you buy a BMW?

What about this "death wobble" with the VFR ?

Dunno. Do the Japanese make bikes? I pretty much ignore them.

I bought the R1200R because I like it. That doesn't mean that I'm going to ignore problems it has so as not to upset BMW or anyone else for that matter.

I also have a VFR that I like very much but it also had a problem that the dealer corrected when the manufacturer refused. You really should get past your anti-Japanese bike mindset and try riding some of them like the Goldwing or VFR or FJR or Concours 14 or Bandit or Vstrom. They make some very fine bikes, none of which are perfect just as BMW isn't perfect.

Just because someone criticizes issues with a particular bike doesn't mean he or she doesn't like it, on the contrary in some cases. I like the R1200R enough that I am taking the time to express my concern over the 1st gear shifting issue and encouraging other R1200R owners to do the same. If we sit back quietly BMW will never fix it.

builtforcomfort wrote: Did we buy the wrong bike to begin with? Maybe we should have gotten a R1200RT or a ST1300 or an FJR.

I'm pretty sure your gripe about getting into 1st gear will not go away with the R1200ST.

I said it somewhere here before - you're not riding a disposable appliance when you buy a Beemer. They're not poifect, but they have character, lineage, history, pedigree, a certain amount of rarity, and style.

Others bikes may (for you) as well, and if they float your boat more, you're certainly more than able to buy one, with all the money you'd make selling your overpriced BMW.

In any case, I hope you give it a chance. If you focus on the one or two things you don't like about it all the time, that's what it will become to you. I must admit feeling similarly about it (but not quite as strongly) when I first brought mine home, but I've learned to ignore (or eliminate by experience and/or with farkles) the niggly things.

Now, I have acheived a zen-like state of acceptance and - dare I say it - loooooovvve....

Hey, I like futzing around trying to improve things.

I'd be bored washing my Honda over and over.

And, no-one would give it a second look.

My 2¢

Peter

Don't you see when you spent your how many dollars on the different bikes you have, the message you sent them is that they are doing a good job. You cast your vote with your wallet, so don't whine afterwards. I've owned Goldwings, BMW's and Yamaha's and ALL have had an issue getting into first gear. As a youg man, I drove a Mack truck and we all knew that you cleared the trans by putting it into second before going to reverse. You are literally the first person I have ever heard gripe about a trany not going into gear immediately, every time you try. Really. And motorcycles are, if nothing else, something you modify to be you. From the very begining. Everyone is fundamentaly built different, so how are you supposed to expect a maufacturer to make one bike to fit all, especially since everyone buys a bike for a different purpose. And that is why there are dozens of aftermarket items for each concievable part. Want a TPM ? There are aftermarket ones that are probably as good and cheaper than the BMW ones. Maybe you should have waited for a model to come in with one on it if it was so important. For me, a tire gauge works just as well for hundreds less. At this point, I think the only way for you to send a message is to run a BIG internet ad offering your poorly made, marketed and overly priced BMW for sale at a ridicuously low price, say $ 7,000, since that is all it really is worth. Name all the stuf you don't like about the bike and the manufacturer and then post it, with copies to BMW NA...and one to me first so I can get the cash out ofthe bank.

Sy Sims in NYC (a clothing retailer) had a catch-phrase line that has always stuck with me.. "An educated consumer is our best customer.."

Reading "After purchasing my 08 R1200R I asked the dealer about a tire press. retro fit." - I have to question the "After".. why not before?

Small edit: Also "I just bought another bike and it was.......a Honda VFR. I will never buy another bike, no matter how good they are, from BMW." means that BMW can happily ignore you and whatever you post since you've told them you're never going to be a BMW customer again. They tend to try to please potential customers, not non-customers. Counterproductive sort of thing to say IMHO.

I will never buy another bike, no matter how good they are, from BMW

...this kills me...

You're stating you bought a supposedly superior product (VFR) because it was superior, then go on to say you'll never buy another BMW - even if it's superior.



Seems counterproductive. And illogical.

FYI, if you're here to start a BMW hating group, you're in the wrong forum... you should check out the Jo Momma forum at the ADV site.