Need help with my 2004 R1150RA

[FordPrefect]

I purchased a 2004 R1150RA Red with approximately 3500 in 2007 for $6500, plus shipping, has a slight blemish on the left side of the bike, slight yellowing of the case, the owner said the bike was parked outside next to garage that was on fire, everything was repaired and blemish was really unnoticeable, bike was running like a new bike, after all it had 3500 miles on the odometer, no warranty at time of purchase, the QD were replaced do to a re-call by a dealer who did the initial inspection and who acted as a intermediary between me and the seller. Everything was kosher, and bike was shipped within few days. The valve cover has some scratches so I purchased new one and never got a chance to install them, work crazy hours.

Had a Milwaukee BMW dealer do the the full fluid service as soon as I took delivery of the bike, about $230.

Then I had the same BMW dealer do the 6500 mile service, at a cost of about $720, at this point I had the dealer install the chain tensioner upgrade, valve covers, which I purchased right after I received the bike, I noticed it was very noise, noisier then any other BMW in my stable, including the much older R models, I thought nothing of it, after all I own a BMW that had 500,000 miles on it, and am in the process of restoring it.

Well after 2 years of service my 2004 R1150RA is acting up, sad thing is that I just had my 2nd service or 6500 mile service and few weeks after I noticed a engine pinging, took it back to dealer think they left something lose, like valve adjuster bolts, or something, the dealer was really nice he had me bring the bike checked it out, I thought it might be the timing belt, since I believe the original owner had the bike sitting for a long time, that would explain the low miles on a 2004 bike. The bike was purchased from individual residing in North Carolina. After spending few hours the dealer has no clue what the issue may be, verified chain tensioner, timing belt, not sure what to do at this point, love to find a retired BMW mechanic in the Milwaukee Wisconsin area that would be willing to help me isolate issue, I may decide to do a total restore of the engine, I am a perfectionist, I want my bike to sound and ride like it suppose to at 7500 miles, I will not lose my faith in BMW, I know that this bike has low miles on it, and there is no reason for this bike to sound like this, something is wrong and and I need to find out what it is.

Anyone interested in giving a helping hand please send me email, thanks in advance.

[email protected]

[boxermania]

Although your post was quite explicit it is somewhat difficult to trobleshoot from the description. What I'm about to say and you probably won't like it is:

You should have returned the bike to the dealer after the the 6500 mile service as based on the work they did only a couple of things could have gone wrong to lead to the noise increase.

Was the tensioner (left) really replaced, or if replaced could it have been installed wrong (which I doubt and as you mentioned the dealer check again at a later time) and where the valves adjusted improperly. On te other hand if there was some slack on the timing chain I ould be worried about the valves impacting the piston top (I don't think this is the case either)

The tensioner upgrade has a different size cover nut than the original, one is 17mm and the other 15mm. Do a search for a post by Boxer as he has some good pics of the process and then check the cover on your bike.

I would suggest going to another dealer or indi for a second oppinion....good luck.

[R4R&R]

I would suggest going to another dealer or indi for a second oppinion....good luck.

+1!!!!!

[Hottech]

I was under the impression that the 2004 models came stock with the new and improved chain tensioners, am I mistaked?

[bimrluvr]

2004 is when they changed over from single to dual spark...and they made some other changes mid-year too...perhaps the dual spark models shipped with the cam tensioner upgrade.
BTW, FordPrefect, is your '04 single or dual spark?

[FordPrefect]

Although your post was quite explicit it is somewhat difficult to trobleshoot from the description. What I'm about to say and you probably won't like it is:

You should have returned the bike to the dealer after the the 6500 mile service as based on the work they did only a couple of things could have gone wrong to lead to the noise increase.

I took the bike back to the dealer two days after it started to make noises that was not there before, or about two weeks after the 6500 mile service. There was no reason for me to take it back before that, even though I thought that the bike was running a little slow, not as responsive as before the service, if that helps.

Was the tensioner (left) really replaced, or if replaced could it have been installed wrong (which I doubt and as you mentioned the dealer check again at a later time) and where the valves adjusted improperly. On te other hand if there was some slack on the timing chain I ould be worried about the valves impacting the piston top (I don't think this is the case either)

Yes, the chain tensioner was replaced on the left cylinder, and the usual chain noise disappeared for about two weeks or about the time that this new noise appeared, two weeks after the 6500 mile service.

The tensioner upgrade has a different size cover nut than the original, one is 17mm and the other 15mm. Do a search for a post by Boxer as he has some good pics of the process and then check the cover on your bike.

This not an issue, I actually provided the dealer with the instructions on how to install the chain tensioner upgrade for the R1150R. The service manager was under the impression that in order to replace the chain tensioner he had to disassemble the left cylinder, go figure, ding, ding. This is the link I provided for the service manager in order to convince him that removal of the cylinder was not necessary.

http://advwisdom.hogranch.com/Wisdom/Ca ... rSwap.html

I would suggest going to another dealer or indi for a second oppinion....good luck.

Hindsight twenty twenty, who would have know that after the 6500 mile service this bike would get worse....no way to predict that on a bike with 7500 miles on it, come on. BMW should have done a recall on all R1150R that had the old chain tensioner period, why would BMW want a new bike to sound like a bike with 75,000 miles plus is unbelievable...What I learned from this experience is that I should have done the job myself, this job was fairly simple, time was my enemy (I work weird hours), thus I took it to the only BMW motorcycle dealer in Milwaukee, I have done a upper engine rebuild on my 1976 R90/6, and it was as easy as reading instructions, the honing of the cylinders was jobbed out to a machine shop, but I did all the assembly and disassembly work myself, I have all the tools and manuals required.

[FordPrefect]

I would suggest going to another dealer or indi for a second oppinion....good luck.

+1!!!!!

Like I said above in response to boxermania "hindsight is twenty twenty"...I just want to hear some suggestions from others, the more suggestions the better, and I do have a contingency plan C, and that would be I will ride it for the rest of the season taking it easy, no 100+ mile per hour sprints, then in October I will disassemble left cylinder and go trough it, check all the measurements, I have hunch it may be the either the valve springs, or perhaps the short push-rods.

[FordPrefect]

I was under the impression that the 2004 models came stock with the new and improved chain tensioners, am I mistaked?

No, Hottech I think you're mistaken the 2004 models, at least my 2004 R1150RA didn't come with the new and improved chain tensioner and this was only an issue with the left side cylinder, had an issue with oil not getting into the chain tensioner spring assembly, well see this link, it will explains all the detail, if you are interested...

http://advwisdom.hogranch.com/Wisdom/Ca ... rSwap.html

This should have been a recall by BMW, it is a shame they didn't react in time, after all we all now know it was a engineering flow, but one that was more a aesthetic nuisance then a real mechanical problem, but still I think that it could lead to a mechanical problem in the long run, at least I believe that. My particular bike had many recalls, that the Capital BMW worked when I purchased the bike while it was in their possession, well at least the ones that the original owner failed to take care of or address.

[FordPrefect]

2004 is when they changed over from single to dual spark...and they made some other changes mid-year too...perhaps the dual spark models shipped with the cam tensioner upgrade.
BTW, FordPrefect, is your '04 single or dual spark?

bimrluvr I have the dual spark plug heads and ABS breaks...and no they didn't come with the chain tensioner upgrade, I purchased mine from Chicago BMW for a around $65 for everything I needed, which I provided to the Milwaukee BMW dealer to install at the 6500 mile service.

[boxermania]

FordPrefect

I aluded to taking it back to the dealer based on the fact that you had paid for the service and the bike, according to you was noisy. Logically that would be the first thing to do, but sometimes we, homo sapiens believe that things will get back to normal in due time....yes, we procrastinate.

That being said, as a fairly new owner you will learn that BMW Motorrad does a lot of things that would be tantamount to keeping customers true to their brand.....you are probably experiencing one of the instances.

The bikes are fairly easy to maintain and work on and it appears that you might have what it takes, however, before you rip into it I would find another bike to compare to, I'm sure that there is someone around your neck of the woods with one.

Best of luck and keep us posted on your findings.

[FordPrefect]

FordPrefect

I aluded to taking it back to the dealer based on the fact that you had paid for the service and the bike, according to you was noisy. Logically that would be the first thing to do, but sometimes we, homo sapiens believe that things will get back to normal in due time....yes, we procrastinate.

boxermania when the bike came back from the dealer it had no noise, it was the way I expected the bike to sound with low miles. When I got bike back it rained few days so I didn't have chance to ride it much the first week, but two weeks later I notices sound coming back, almost like the chain tensioner was installed improperly, I also notice that the bike was slower at accelerating when you give it gas, as soon as I heard the sound I called the dealer back, and they told me to bring it back, there was no procrastination. When I purchased the bike it didn't sound that bad, but being a perfectionist (a flaw in some Homo sapiens) I wanted a bike to sound flawless, having owned many BMW's before, I was not happy with the extra chain noise at higher and lower RPM's, no chain noises at any RPM's. So after scouring the Internet I found out that BMW had a upgrade for the chain tensioner, that is when I made the purchase of all the parts needed.

That being said, as a fairly new owner you will learn that BMW Motorrad does a lot of things that would be tantamount to keeping customers true to their brand.....you are probably experiencing one of the instances.

Again I have owned BMW's since 1980's, I happen to own 1963 R69S, 1963 R60US, 1960 R50/2, 1974 R90S, and got rid of my 1976 R90/6 which was a flawless bike, and incredible machine that purred like a kitten, sold it for more money then what I originally paid for. So I am hardly a fairly new owner, unless you meant a new owner of newer BMW model...now as for R1150R I love this bike, it looks great, sounds great, silent killer, looking at the bike from the front and from the rear a very pleasing bike (sexy ), the tank with two separate oil coolers (each cylinder has its own oil cooler) is what makes it much better looking bike then the new R1200R, it also kept the oil cooler away from the exhaust, unlike R1200R an aesthetic design flaw. As for other motorcycle brands I also own a 1968 Triumph Bonneville (15,00 original miles), a 1968 BSA Royal Star (a 100 point restoration with 8500 original miles), and a 1968 G15CS Norton Matchless hybrid, and few others that I got rid of in the last few years, too many bikes to maintain, draining my financial resources. But you can see which brand I favor...

I also may send a latter to BMW Motorrad describing my experience with the 2004 R1150RA, see what they have to say, after all this bike has 7500 miles on it, maybe they can recommend something. I actually used BMW Motorrad to find out about the current bike, by providing the VIN number they checked the bikes history, etc. all via email and I even spoke to person over the phone once, while I was shopping for a newer BMW.

The bikes are fairly easy to maintain and work on and it appears that you might have what it takes, however, before you rip into it I would find another bike to compare to, I'm sure that there is someone around your neck of the woods with one.

Best of luck and keep us posted on your findings.

The mechanic at the Milwaukee BMW dealership has the same bike as mine 2004 R1150RA and same color red, except that his bike is clean, and sounds flawless. As I said the original owner had the bike parked next to a garage that got on fire, the left side of the bike had slight fire damage, now did the fire cause any damage to the bike internally, that would surface two years latter? I don't think so, since the damage was fairly minor, slight yellowing on the "a arm" and under the left cylinder and various cables show signs of fire damage on the left side, but all minor. The dealer found a bad oil switch, it was leaking oil around the switch on the left side cylinder, and said that the cylinder was running hot at some point, also the spark plug coil was replaced it broke off when the mechanic was trying to take it out, and the high beam switch needs to be replaced, which I didn't bother to replace at this time.

Thanks boxermania, I will definitely keep you guys posted on progress. I am going to get the bike from the dealer in few days, they want $145 cover few hours of labor. Anyone know the cost of a brand new 2004 R1150R motor?

[Hottech]

Checked out my cam chain tensioner and it has a 17mm head, 2004 R1150R with ABS so I guess it is not the updated one. I never noticed any excess rattle but I imagine a new and improved tensioner may not be a bad thing to do. I priced them at a few online stores and the going price is around $80 for the three parts to do the upgrade, plus shipping cost. Anyone interested in doing a group buy? I can make some calls to see what kind of discount we could get.

[Turk74]

FordPerfect,

I'm in the Milwaukee area, I actually work a couple miles away from the dealership and I have a 2004 R1150RA. About 6 months ago I installed the new and improved cam tensioner and it made a world of difference to my bike. I currently have 31000 miles on it. If you need a bike to compare the sounds to, let me know.

Dave

[Buckster]

I often wondered if mine was done by the previous owner or not. What size is the updated version? I have not noticed any noise but maybe I'm used to it. I would like to update it if it hasn't been done.

[FordPrefect]

FordPerfect,

I'm in the Milwaukee area, I actually work a couple miles away from the dealership and I have a 2004 R1150RA. About 6 months ago I installed the new and improved cam tensioner and it made a world of difference to my bike. I currently have 31000 miles on it. If you need a bike to compare the sounds to, let me know.

Dave

Dave,

Sent you a PM, yes lets get together and see if there is a difference between the two bikes...

Michael

[riceburner]

Ford,

You sound like someone who'd be very capable of checking out the cylinder head internals within an hour's time.
I'd recommend you get your hands slightly dirty and check the valve clearances, valve end float, and drop all the plugs, clean them up (they won't have been changed), and check the firing of all plugs - it could be that one of the stick coils has failed - especially if the tech had trouble getting it out of the head.

Checking a stick coil is easy .

[FordPrefect]

Ford,

You sound like someone who'd be very capable of checking out the cylinder head internals within an hour's time.
I'd recommend you get your hands slightly dirty and check the valve clearances, valve end float, and drop all the plugs, clean them up (they won't have been changed), and check the firing of all plugs - it could be that one of the stick coils has failed - especially if the tech had trouble getting it out of the head.

Checking a stick coil is easy .

riceburner yes, I can do the work, no problem, my problem is time. See my post below, I just picked up the bike from the dealer, and I am very disappointed.

[FordPrefect]

WOW, wow, just picked up the bike and it sounds worse then when I took it in for the 6500 mile service, and the dealers competence is now questionable (I wanted to refrain from bashing the dealer or the head mechanic), but now a very loud valve pinging coming from the right hand side cylinder. The service manager nice guy, had nothing much to say, I got a feeling they know what is wrong, they had the audacity to ask if I wanted them to fix it? So, $145.78 dollars less in my pocket and I have no clue what the issue is, it seems to change every time I take the bike in to this dealer. I like the owner's grandson but incompetence is inexcusable.

The left side is not an issue any more but, but did the dealer install the left side chain tensioner incorrectly? Would this cause the current issue? It was not that loud when I took it in for the service, I forgot to tell you that the dealer actually broke the stick coil, and made me pay for it, unbelievable (since they never called me to tell me that it was seized).

When I got the bike from the dealer after the 6500 mile service I thought it sounded rough, like the throttle bodies were never synchronized by the dealer. Did they actually do a 6500 mile service, I asked the service manager what 6500 mile service entailed and he listed tons of stuff, that I doubt they did, at this point? So I am very disappointed they sound really nice on the phone but fall short on customer service. I am very pissed, I don't think they did any real work on this bike accept change the left side oil switch, insulate oil switch harness, which is way to close to the exhaust pipes, and changed plugs and replace one stick coil. TB's were not synchronized, that is for sure, I should have taken the bike right back to them, the next day and have them correct it all the issue at that time (but I did not notice anything different except that bike was slightly rough, the weather here in Wisconsin make this bike behave differently, if very humid it loves humid, days when it is wet, it hates hot dry days that is when it sounds rough), oh well live and learn.

Well I will start the disassembly process this Sunday, I will take left side head of first then the right head, and see what is going on? I am at a lost that a dealer would let the bike in this condition leave. Does anyone in Milwaukee area that has a Twinmax carburetor sync unit, I can use, I buy lunch? I will take the new chain tensioner out just to see if they install it wrong, it may show some wear marks or something?

[boxermania]

FordPrefect

Why on earth do you want to undertake a major dissasembly with no clue as to what is the nature of the problem? Had to get it off my chest......

Please call me at (225) 445-6922 after 6 pm CT and let me see if i can be of help.

[boxermania]

This link should provide a good reference to the chain tensioner, old vs new.....

viewtopic.php?f=18&t=4657 ...

and an inexpensive water manometer to sync the idle and the TB's

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r87/ ... 1241153464

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r87/ ... 1241153562 ...