BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

My '97 made it through winter just fine with the exception of the steering damper. Found a little puddle under there and the thing is shot. I'm sure some people would just remove it for good but as someone who believes it's there for a reason, I've decided on replacement. Now for some questions -

1) Got my name on the list at the beemer boneyard, but if nothing comes up within a week or two I plan to buy new. Go OEM ($290 retail/$232 from Chicago) or look into something rebuildable (HyperPro $350)? Anyone who's experienced both?

2) In the meantime, would it be better to remove it than leave the old one one? The old one doesn't offer any resistance, but I worry it could seize up or something.

The steering damper only offers resistance the faster you push the handlebars back & forth
to simulate a tank slap... it will work

You can leave it on it wont seize

In Australia they are $600, and was disappointed that the other one which was new only lasted
a very short period of time...

BMW steering dampeners are the only ones i have heard that fail

Hello pinecone,

in my opinion you don't need to shell out that much money because the steering damper can be repaired. The steering damper of the oilhead is notorious for being faulty after some time and some german rider have successfully repaired the same. The cost per seal should be around US$ 8 (in Germany approx EURO 5 per piece)

What you need:
- 2 shaft seal rings 10X20X7/8,5 (inner dia x outer dia x height/height + lid). Made by KACO, order No. 73839099 - in North America available here http://www.metric-seals.com
- fork oil visco 10 (approx 60 cubic-cm)
- loctite (for the mounting screws of the damper at the fork crown)
- new screw for fixing the damper to the lower fork-crown

What you need to do:
a) remove the steering damper from your bike (you need to heat the screw at the fork-crown to 120°C as otherwise you will not be able to unscrew)
b) remove the ball joint at the end of the rod
c) on both sides of the steering damper remove the snap rings and the washers
d) use a spine and peel out the seal (will be destroyed) at one side of the damper
e) under the seal you'll find a piece made of brass (maybe some kind of valve), remove as well and memorize position!
e) remove all the oil from the damper
f) remove the piston rod
g) remove the seal on the other side (see d)
h) remove the brass piece as well and memorize position - clean!
i) mount brass piece on one side of the damper
j) mount shaft seal ring on same side of the damper (use a hex nut and a plastic hammer)
k) carefully insert piston rod
l) fill damper with fork oil (fill until seat of the seal)
m) mount second brass piece and seal (here maybe use a tubular-wrench)
n) mount washers and snap rings on both sides

and you're ready!!

If someone is able to read German please see a more detailed description here: http://wiki.bmw-bike-forum.info/index.p ... reparieren

Kind regards
Oliver

Amendmend May 17, 2008: you need to heat the fasteners on both sides of the damper to approx 120°C. This is because Loctite 2701 is used and it needs heat to be able to unfasten. Also you need to apply Loctite 2701 when mounting the damper again!

I know I'm a litle late to this party but I just found out today that my steering dampler on my 2000 R1100R is shot; dealer pointed it out while having routine maintenance done. Seriously, I had no idea; on the way home, ~ 60 min ride, I paid strict attention to steering responsiveness intentionally speeding and slowing suddenly and making sudden moves and swerves and I swear I couldn't tell anything was amiss. Of course, I realize I was probably being a little more consciously protective while seeing if I could induce a problem; when I got it home and up on its stand, the front wheel is so loose it almost turns freely with a good breeze.

Dealer quoted me ~ $350 to repair; followed pinecone's lead and checked at Beemer boneyard and saw used one for $145 (via a waiting list) but truly I don't like the idea of me installing one, even if I could find one, as I'm not the most mechanically talented when it comes to stuff like this.

Is this something I need to seek immediate remedy for? Is it even necessary to actively pursue? What would be the consequences of not replacing/repairing it at all? Couldn't help noting someone else's comments that "if its there, its probably there for a reason" I do realize that I won't always be riding with a possible steering damper problem foremost on my mind (as I was today) but also realize the bike, by its very nature, is strong when it comes to riding and handling.

Thanks,

From someone with no direct BMW motorcycle knowledge, but tons of mechanical experiences like this -

I agree with Pinecone's assertion that if it was designed to be there, it has a purpose. Over on the Porsche and BMW car forums it's a common topic to discuss who's smarter - the Porsche/BMW engineers or the consumer.

Even though the engineers may know the product well, the bean counters often intervene. End result is good design with cheap parts, i.e. trunk shocks on Porsches and steering dampers on BMW motorcycles.

That said, I would replace all defective parts with new OEM or, in some instances like this, a known and proven upgrade. The last thing I would do (but I would still do it if I had no alternative) is replace a part that I know is failure prone with another identical part from a recycler. To me that is buying a very expensive time bomb.

My brother in law (a fellow BMW rider from Minneapolis!) says "Buy quality, cry once". I would consider the expensive, rebuildable aftermarket damper and be done with it.

Must not need one anyway-my 2004 R1150R didn't even come with one. Why all the fuss? I'd really like to know. Did they change ball joint or top steering bearing or geometry so they could eliminate the damper? -Glenn.

Naturally I checked mine after reading this thread and it's shot. Fwiw - I'm going to do the rebuild as described by omg1010.

R1100RT does not have one either. My 02' K1200LT had one but none adjustable. I would want one that was adjustable. Are the R1100R's adjustable?

Ya it's definitely there for a reason, and not just for extreme tank slapping events. It provides general front end stability.

Mine is finally wearing out after 66K. It has only minimal resistance at the outermost points of travel, and appears to have started leaking a little as well.

Result: I can feel a slight "unsteadiness" up front, especially at highway speeds. I'm fairly certain the damper is the culprit.

Thanks for the re-build info!

A quick followup message from my earlier post. I took my R bike to the dealer this week for the work I mentioned (in another thread, I think) - steering damper replacement, brake line bleeding, annual service (drain and replace all fluids). Well, the steering damper hadn't come in (even though the order was placed 10 days in advance) and the service manager knew how much trouble it had been for me to get in (Atlanta morning rush hour traffic!!!). Instead of making another appointment for me to come in for the damper, he just told me we could install it with the next tire changeout. I reminded him that I had just had new tires put on last week to which he replied, "yes, I know". While he didn't come right out and say that it wasn't that important of a piece of equipment, he kinda insinuated that. Anyway, I'll roll with that and see what happens . . .

Fact is that the R1150R + Rockster did not have a steering damper but has exactly the same geometry. Hence even BMW did not see the necessity for the damper any more. I have meanwhile modified my R1100R: installed the telelever of the R1150, no steering damper and replaced the oil coolers (those little ears on top of the cylinders) with a centrally installed cooler under the telelever.

I am running without the steering damper for almost 1000 kms and I can report that until now I did not miss it at all. The only place where I feel a little difference is long bends on highways at high speed (above 160 km/h) where my oilhead gets a little wobbly.

Best regards
Oliver

My 1100RT has floating rotors. My 1150's did not. The new RT that my bud rides does not have them either. Strange.....

Are the floating rotors somehow related to the steering damper? Maybe I'hve been missing something ...

Rgds
Oliver

omg1010 wrote:Are the floating rotors somehow related to the steering damper? Maybe I'hve been missing something ...

Rgds
Oliver

I am just trying to figure out what is stock and what is not. I have owned 6 and not all are the same. Got me thinking with the damper.
Steve

This is due to the new wheels. On the R1150 models the newer 5-spoke wheels have been used (just like at the R1100S) where the disks are directly bolted onto the wheel. On the 1100 models (3-spoke cast wheels) the discs where fixed onto a carrier which was then bolted onto the wheel ...

Kind regards
Oliver

HikerGlenn wrote:Must not need one anyway-my 2004 R1150R didn't even come with one. Why all the fuss? I'd really like to know. Did they change ball joint or top steering bearing or geometry so they could eliminate the damper? -Glenn.

Steering dampers are generally for tank slappers and the R1200R does have 110hp right? But I wouldn't think you'd need the damper unless you were hell fire accelerating on a regular basis. It does give one a certain pucker factor when it happens though . If you didn't notice any adverse handling after it went bad (or you knew about it) then it must not server too much of a mechanical purpose other than preventing tank slap. Have you tried contacting BMW about it? (out of curiosity)

hi, I just disassembled the steering damper as described in post by omg1010. Here are my 2c:

* unscrew the rear part of the rod with screwdriver. Shaft comes in 2 parts. Pull the rear part with screw slot out and drain the oil.
* if washer is stuck, heat up the damper from outside with a heat gun and pry the washer out with a small screwdriver
* be patient while removing oil seal not to damage the seat. If you have a puller, use it. Otherwise, carefully drill out the seal metal core in several places and pull the seal out with nose pliers.
* push the second part of the rod out together with brass stopper/valve
* ideally, it would be nice to be able to replace piston and small o-ring (between 2 parts of shaft to ensure that performance of damper stays within factory specs. If someone knows who makes these dampers, getting these parts would make it totally rebuildable.
* I called http://www.metric-seals.com and the guy quoted me $64 ($8 shipping included) for two seals. These guys are ripoffs, seals are worth $7 apiece. Fortunately, I can obtain them from Germany at that price.

I will keep you posted of progress being made and the final results. May add few photos to illustrate the procedure.

I found out that BMW added the steering damper to their design during pre-production testing. There are mixed opinions whether it is needed at all in most of the riding conditions. My take is that it you don't wanna find that out during an evasive maneuver at high speed.

vknajtner wrote: I found out that BMW added the steering damper to their design during pre-production testing. There are mixed opinions whether it is needed at all in most of the riding conditions. My take is that it you don't wanna find that out during an evasive maneuver at high speed.

As said earlier due to the use of the R1150R A-arm I removed my steering damper and never had any problem (not even at high speed). Another good point is that the R1150R shares the same geometric data as the R1100R but the R1150 does not have a steering damper (factory default) and does not even have the mount points. Hence there should not be a problem when removing the damper. The only issue may be when using a windshield causing the bike to get lighter on the front or driving under heavy load (also causing the front to get lighter) ...

Kind regards
Oliver

Never had an instance of tank slapper (or any significant headshake) while riding R850R, R1100R, R1150R Roadster or Rockster. 10k+ miles on each with exception of the 1100, which was Mrs. Sweatmark's bike, on which I rode an Iron Butt during a nasty Pacific storm and pureed a small bird with the front wheel spokes. I tend to think the 1150s are more stable based on hand-off riding using throttle lock (you can ride the 1150s for miles this way), and perhaps that sense of stability (subjective or objective) has something to do with BMW's decision to equip earlier oilheads with dampers and the 1150s without.

Nonetheless, why not use an eBay steering damper to replace a crapped-out R850/1100 unit? There are plenty if used dampers to be had for a pittance, and if damper mount compatibility can be managed, then why shell out significant cash for the OE piece?

If you accept the notion that a steering damper's principal role is prevent tank slapper oscillation and loss of control, then the damper's exact damping rate (at slow steering angle rate of change) is not significant, just its high yaw rate damping.

I don't buy the idea that a steering damper impacts normal riding steering stability, because the dynamics of front wheel motion and bike behavior are dominated by front wheel inertia and turning moment.

Oliver's testimony about good steering stability with his R1100R using R1150R Telelever A-arm (without damper) speaks loudest on this issue.

I plan on rebuilding my steering damper this winter (1 of the 3 projects I have planned). vknajtner, can you possibly post a link to your German source for the seals needed for the rebuild?
I do notice some headshake on full-throttle acceleration in first gear, especially riding 2-up. If all I have to do is spend a few dollars and some of my time to reduce or eliminate it I will consider it an effort well spent. I certainly won't pay what a dealer wants for a new damper. The Hyperpro product is just out of the question.
omg1010, thanks for outlining the procedure. Love your R by the way.
Thanks,
Mike