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loom failure
Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 11:36 pm
by desmophil
Over the last week or so I have had an intermitant problem with not being unable to cancel the indicators on my '04 R1150R (Australian model). I recalled reading some riders having premature switch failure because, like me, they tend to cancel the indicators more than necassary just to be safe.
However, yesterday I noticed that if I held down the indicator cancel switch and turned the bars the switch worked reliably. Hmmm - thinks - that seems like a wiring loom problem. I quickly traced the fault to where the loom bends around the steering head and heads rearward. I sliced open the outer cover and found a nearly broken brown wire which is obviously the switch lead. An easy repair and problem fixed.
So - have a look at where your wiring loom wraps around the right hand side of the steering head. If it is tight when on full lock cut the cable ties and reposition it.
Easy as.
Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 11:59 pm
by CycleRob
desmophil,
I see you're new here with 5 posts, but the problem you experienced and solved is an old one to the group. It's good you spoke up. You were lucky it was only the signal cancel circuit and not one that cuts the engine off.
Your advice to cut the overly restrictive ziptie restraints was, besides being correct, shows that the factory, or more accurately, the assembly line, doesn't always do the right thing. I cut several harness restraining zipties in 2001 on both sides so at least a 12" long large radius loop (on both sides) is able to hang free when the steering goes lock-2-lock. Even though it is not restrained, there are no harness pinching or chaffing issues as you'll see when you turn the steering to the locks.
Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 2:27 am
by DJ Downunder
Been there..done that...What a bugger!
My dealer said it was DEFIANTLY the switch and I should pay them a few hundred bucks to replace the switch.
Even though I told them the problem came and went as I turned the bars.
I fixed it myself for nothing (as you did) and lost all faith in my dealer.
DJ
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 3:27 am
by CycleRob
I came across this pic in the R1150R manual and added text and red arrows to show the ZipTies that must be cut to avoid certain wire harness failures.
The factory made an error in judgment that must be corrected.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:39 am
by boxermania
Cyclerob
The factory made an error in judgment that must be corrected.
You are being quite nice, IMHO the issue here is that who decided on the ties and routing was cutting costs and didn't quite now what he/she was doing.
1) Using zip ties on a 10K bike !!!
2) Not allowing sufficient slack for not to pull/flex the wires against a stop (the zip tie)
If you remember all the bikes of yesteryear had the metal zip ties of the rubber band variety, never too tight and fairly far appart. Yes most of the looms had quite a bit of movement and didn't look too tidy, but there was never an instance of cut wires, at least during my tenure.
The real shame is the Teutonic arrogance in regards to all these little "they all do that" , as the majority of the issues have been documented time and time again and the
blatant ignorance/lack of work ethic of some techs within the dealer organization.
Ooops is 2008 and one of my new year resolutions is to call it like I see it (I think this is going to be a terrible year for me). I would expect that such comments will land me into one of two categories.,,....he is an old geezer or he is senile.....goody, that let's me get away with it.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:39 am
by DJ Downunder
I'm a bit pissed off with BMW that they did not do a recall about this obvious and common problem...
DJ
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:52 am
by R4R&R
CycleRob wrote:I came across this pic in the R1150R manual and added text and red arrows to show the ZipTies that must be cut to avoid certain wire harness failures.
The factory made an error in judgment that must be corrected.
Once again, CycleRob, you are invaluable to this board.
One of the first 'mods' I did to my bike when I bought it new, was cut the tight zipties and put new ones on that weren't so restrictive. Thanks to everyone on this board that mentioned that one years ago!
DJ Downunder wrote:I'm a bit pissed off with BMW that they did not do a recall about this obvious and common problem...
No way - that would cost BMW too much! I think manufacturers only issue recalls when they are forced to, or it's an obvious safety issue that would cause them real bad publicity.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:11 am
by wncbmw
This issue has popped up now and then on the board and I still haven't checked my zip-ties! Had no problem either but now I will check the bike's wiring tomorrow!
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:18 am
by Buckster
It's definitely worth checking...I did last year and found plenty that were tight but none that were actually cutting through. I did replace the ones cyclerob said to remove but I did not even snug them up!! They are just there as a guide more or less...hanging there very loose!
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:39 am
by towerworker
I am rapidly becoming an "old geezer" and proud of it!
(mostly in my professional life)
One becomes an "old geezer" by listening to the good advice of others and heeding that advice and living to help others become "old geezers".
My thanks to all of you "old geezers".
Wayne
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:37 am
by Sunbeemer
While I don't think BMW has had a recall for this problem, my dealer told me they made a plastic clip guard available that snaps onto the headpost to prevent wire chafing there. However, I don't think this will solve the problem of zip-ties cutting into the wire loom, so I did what Cyclerob suggested and wrapped those wires in tape and plastic loom as well. This seems to be working!
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:16 am
by Oilhead
DJ Downunder wrote:I'm a bit pissed off with BMW that they did not do a recall about this obvious and common problem...
DJ
When I went in for the recall on the fuel line a couple of years ago, my dealer told me that there was a service bulletin out regarding the wiring loom and they did that also.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:30 am
by boxermania
boxermania wrote:Cyclerob
The factory made an error in judgment that must be corrected.
You are being quite nice, IMHO, the issue here is that whoever decided on the ties and routing was cutting costs and didn't quite now/understand what he/she was doing.
1) Using zip ties on a 10K bike !!!
2) Not allowing sufficient slack for not to pull/flex the wires against a stop (the zip tie)
If you remember all the bikes of yesteryear had the metal zip ties of the rubber band variety, never too tight and fairly far appart. Yes most of the looms had quite a bit of movement and didn't look too tidy, but there was never an instance of cut wires, at least during my tenure.
The real shame is the Teutonic arrogance in regards to all these little "they all do that" , as the majority of the issues have been documented time and time again and the
blatant ignorance/lack of work ethic of some techs within the dealer organization.
Ooops is 2008 and one of my new year resolutions is to call it like I see it (I think this is going to be a terrible year for me). I would expect that such comments will land me into one of two categories.,,....he is an old geezer or he is senile.....goody, that let's me get away with it.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 4:16 pm
by GypsyRR
I cut a lot of zip ties over a year ago - all that looked restricting, and yet......... when I got to Arkansas and had CycleRob take a look at my bike, I had missed a couple of the important ones. I think the only zip tie on my bike right now is the one holding that throttle rocker cover/guard on my bike!!! I didn't want to lose another one of those! (it's still holding)
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:41 pm
by R4R&R
Oilhead wrote:When I went in for the recall on the fuel line a couple of years ago, my dealer told me that there was a service bulletin out regarding the wiring loom and they did that also.
I think the bulletin from the dealer is regarding the O2 sensor and ignition. There was a recall on that wiring, which was how the O2 sensor wire was routed down to the catalytic converter.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:25 pm
by allanj255
R4R&R wrote:Oilhead wrote:When I went in for the recall on the fuel line a couple of years ago, my dealer told me that there was a service bulletin out regarding the wiring loom and they did that also.
I think the bulletin from the dealer is regarding the O2 sensor and ignition. There was a recall on that wiring, which was how the O2 sensor wire was routed down to the catalytic converter.
You are correct John. Apparantly the "electric pulse" from the O2 sensor wiring caused the ignition to cut out intermitently. I was nearly wiped out at a junction on my 1150R when the engine died without warning when I was half way across the junction. I put it down to "rider error" due to getting used to a new bike, then I got the recall notice 1 week later from BMW. Here is the recall
Models: BMW R Model Motorcycle Year: 2003
Number Potentially Involved: 7,000
Dates of Manufacture: December 2002 – August 2003
Defect: On certain motorcycles (Opposed Twins w/Two-Spark Ignition), the electrical wiring for the oxygen sensor and the ignition lead for the right-hand secondary spark plug have a parallel routing over part of their installation path. The close proximity of these cables may allow the signal from the ignition lead to interfere with the signal from the oxygen sensor wiring. As a result, engine hesitation or misfiring could occur, which could result in a crash.
Remedy: Dealers will re-route the electrical wiring to the oxygen sensor. The manufacturer has reported that owner notification is expected to begin during December 2003. Owners may contact BMW at 1-800-831-1117, Option #4.
Posted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:38 pm
by Oilhead
R4R&R wrote:Oilhead wrote:When I went in for the recall on the fuel line a couple of years ago, my dealer told me that there was a service bulletin out regarding the wiring loom and they did that also.
I think the bulletin from the dealer is regarding the O2 sensor and ignition. There was a recall on that wiring, which was how the O2 sensor wire was routed down to the catalytic converter.
This service bulletin was indeed for the wiring harness chafing. They checked the wiring harness for any signs of chafing, reroute if necessary, then installed a wire edge protector kit.
The service bulletin # is: SIB 61 004 06 054 TC R1150R INSTRUMENT C
The part # for the edge protection is: 51467019965
Re: loom failure
Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:49 pm
by RGuy
I hate to dredge up old threads but it seemed pertinent.
Oilhead, would this be the same TSB of which you speak? If so it would seem that the newer models would not be afflicted with this particular problem. I looked at the wiring harness on my 04 model and the wire ties do not appear to be at the same locations as the diagram above......
NHTSA Item Number: 10001642
Service Bulletin #: 6200103
Replacement #:
Vehicle/Equipment Make: BMW
Vehicle/Eqipment Model: R1150R
Model Year:
Mfg Component Code: 034200 SERVICE BRAKES, HYDRAULIC:FOUNDATION COMPONENTS:HOSES, LINES/PIPING, AND FITTINGS
Date of Bulletin: 2003-05-01
Date Added: 2003-06-17
Summary: INSTRUMENT CARRIER CHAFED BY BRAIDED BRAKE HOSE. *TT
Neal
Re: loom failure
Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 12:32 am
by KiwiRR
I cut the ties at the steering head shown in Cyclerob's diagram when I got my 2002 about 6 months ago. A tip for anyone that does is to check that the left hand side loom doesn't then rub against the horn wiring plug, unfortunately I thought mine would be OK , but alas has now broken the horn wires. Should be an easy fix, and I'll possibly rotate the horn so that the clash is reduced.
Re: loom failure
Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 9:11 am
by Ves
I found that even after cutting those ties, the loom was still bending mostly at the kink that was created while the ties were still on. To prevent that I took about a 4-5 inch length of cable tie (about .25 inch wide one) and taped it to the outside of the loom. It acts like a spring and prevents it from kinking in that same spot, over and over again.