BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

Badger wrote:The ABS system on the 50r will bring the bike to a stop quicker than even the best rider riding a non abs machine....assuming the bike is stood up. It's amazing, but the front wheel is grabby going slow and makes it easy to drop the bike......use the rear when your going slow....

I'd like to talk to anyone who has experimented with pads and the like to minimize the grabbing.
As far as stopping distances and safety with or W/O ABS ? I suspect that in a straight line, on dry pavement, they'll both stop fast enough to give you nosebleed.

My reason for buying ABS had to do with the fact that I ride a lot on crowded rain soaked freeways. I was looking for a safety edge in panic stop conditions. I believe ABS gives you that.

I have read far more concerns about cost and maintenance of ABS then complaints about the operation of the system. The grabby front brake is a problem BMW should address. I suspect it's fixable because mine didn't do it until I had about 1000 miles on the bike. I do agree with you on the linked brakes. I would not like fully linked brakes. I use the rear for slow speed turns, dragging it to stablize the bike.

Just a note on the comments about the '02 RT vs. the R bike. The RT has fully linked brakes and can be a bear in slow speed maneuvers, the ABS equipped R on the other hand is partially linked and allows separate use of the rear brake. In slow maneuvers the R even with ABS is much easier to handle.

The day will come when ABS will be as common on bikes as they are now on cars. Honda has already said this is their goal. Makes perfect sense to me...though Goldwing airbags I can do without

The one exception is sportbikes, that is, until they can produce an ABS system that is is light and offers precise feel and modulation.

Before ordering my bike I asked the dealer his opinion as it is a pretty expensive option. He replied that up until the previous day he would have suggested spending the money on something more useful. However since then he had driven his bike up out of his drive and onto the road as he had done a thousand times before without incident but on this occasion he met a truck coming straight towards him and panic braked, locked up the front and kissed tarmac.
No injuries, just dents. He swears that ABS would have kept the bike upright and in control so suggested I should add it to my options, which I did.
Some months later I was riding past a double parked car when it suddenly turned full lock across the front of me (he was doing an un indicated U turn). I grabbed a large handfull of brake and waited for the impact as there was know where for me to go.

The next sensation I had was looking down onto the drivers face through the window and seeing the colour drain from it whilst I slid back down the tank and back onto the seat. I looked down and saw that my front tyre was 2 inches (no exageration) from his door.

I cannot beleive how quickly and in such a short distance the bike stopped.

ABS? I love it.

I would have the ABS any day - ta!

Of course if you don't like it - don't buy a bike with it. Whatever floats your boat/bakes your noodle/etc/etc. I do not think it is worth a flame war or discussing it.

In regards to the servo, it annoys while stationary, but does not bother me at all. Can live with, will live without. Which I can't say about the ABS. I (nearly) always lock the rear wheel on disk based non-ABS brakes, resulting in slide - so why tempt faith?

Cheers

*whining servo-assisted ABS noise follows*

Well this is the only experience I have had with the BMW ABS. Back in 2000 while riding with a couple buddies the 1200LT leading the group was appraoching a hiway intersection. I was bike #2 and following as we had a stop sign and cross traffic was 55MPH with no stop sign. We had just came down a hill and the LT rolled thru the intersection and was narrowly missed by traffic from both directions. The timing was freak, if either driver had not braked as hard as they did, both vehicles would have hit him. It was so close that 1 of the car drivers returned to give him some grief until he heard of the brake failure. Ron was so shook up at the close call his legs were shaking and he had to sit down. He never rode that bike again. Refused to ride it. Would not accept any excuses from the dealer. Towed it to the dealer and traded for a GS without ABS. The LT only had 6K miles. I had to watch this happen right in front of me. He was VERY LUCKY that day!!! Also lucky it was a 4way and not a t intersection. Unbelievably close call. To this day he does not ride any bike with ABS. Can't say I blame him. Ron was semi pro motocross for almost 20 years and had at the time probably 22 years of slab experience. Very experienced rider. My 2 cents---

About three years ago, I experienced a power booster (servo) failure in heavy commuter traffic on a '02 K1200RS. In addition, since the booster malfunctioned, so did the ABS system. Result was some front brake effect and NO REAR BRAKE. (Trying to balance 660lbs of motorcycle while using only front brake to stop, while attempting to ward off brain dead cagers, can take the edge off a good day)

BMWNA did repair the bike under warranty, but I was never again comfortable with the overly complicated Servo assist ABS system. I later traded the KRS for a non ABS Roadster.

More recently, a friend in Phoenix had an ABS failure on her '03 K1200GT, which resulted in a four week down time. No loaner either!!

My GL1800 has Honda's ABS and linked brake feature. To my knowledge, I have not heard of an ABS brake failure on a Gold Wing.

Ed..

I think we can go for months on discussing which is better ABS or Non-ABS. The bottom line is....the advantage of having ABS is certainly much higher than not having ABS. I realize it is a complicated system, and a small amount of bikes have had servo failure....let me tell you something, I'll take those chances and ride my ABS bike anyday over a non-abs model. The Germans know what they are doing, and they do it right. That's why I bought the bike in the first place! This is my experience with the bike (and brakes). All my buddies here in Italy that ride with me all prefer ABS. In my opinion, there will be a day in the future when people will say "do you remember when bikes didn't have ABS???" My two cents....(euro cents)

The Germans know what they are doing, and they do it right

After owning BMW motorcycles and German automobiles for near 40 years, I don't think I want to go there!!

Ed..

ABS is desirable, but it does not make or break my desire to ride. I have two other bikes made by manufacturers that do not offer ABS on any of their bikes - Suzuki and Harley.

If safety is that much of a concern for me, I'd do the math on the probability of biting it on a motorcycle and choose to drive a car instead. Risk is part of the fun in motorcycling. Having ABS certainly improves our survivability odds. But compared to driving an automobile, we're still out of our minds for riding.

Oh ebiker.....If you don't like German engineering, why did you buy a BMW? Just curious. If you had a bad experience with other german products, why did you buy a German Motorcycle?? I used to own a Corvette and a Harley Fat Boy.....never again. In my opinion people shouldn't pay excess money for a product and have quality defects and rattling (corvette).

italr1150r wrote:

.....If you don't like German engineering, why did you buy a BMW? Just curious

Did I say I didn't like German engineering?? Me? A former VW service manager and technican? Well, if you must know....BMW motorcycle dealerships have given me great deals for the past 20 years of so in order to keep me as a customer. And since I was a VW technican, the type 247 design was an easy maintenance item. And, with numerous dealership locations in those days, parts supply problems were a non-issue. Problems did arise, IMO, when BMWAG decided to equal the Japanese in design and engineering, to attract the "spike haired" younger riders always looking for "cutting edge technology", or to impress other riders.

If you had a bad experience with other german products, why did you buy a German Motorcycle??

Well I could reply--it's none of your business, 'cause it's my money! But I've had very few problems with Mercedes Benz Diesels for over 25 years. The 110, 114 and 123 series Diesels were low maintenance vehicles. After market parts and accessories were inexpensive. The Audi I-5 engine was another good German design.

Now....junior...tell us your experience with German technology and since you live in Italy, why you aren't you riding a Moto Guzzi or Ducati?

Ed..

Mr. Ebiker, you got me there, I am not a mechanic or a dealer manager. My field is the airlines as I'm a first officer. Thanks for the compliment in calling me "junior", if 36 years old is "junior". You are right, I am from Italy, but I was born in Florida. I hope you didn't get the impression that I am "anti-american" buy putting down Corvettes and Harleys. All I'm trying to say is that if you have a bad experience with a certain product, it is normal you would not go back to it. I owned Corvettes and Harleys in the past, and they were all plagued with quality problems. Therefore, as a consumer, I wish not to purchase them in the future. As for living in Italy, I do own a Ducati 998 for when I'm out with my mates, and I drive a Ferrari 360. Both in cutting edge technology and style. I love riding my R1150R when I'm with my wife, as it is more comfortable than my 998. Don't take it the wrong way.

italr1150r wrote:As for living in Italy, I do own a Ducati 998 for when I'm out with my mates, and I drive a Ferrari 360.

You suck.

Where did you hear this? I've not seen anything from BMW on this topic.

--Phil

>>>At least BMW have extended the srevice inteval for fluid change to 4 years in the centre circuits which keeps down the cost.<<<

philm35 wrote:Where did you hear this? I've not seen anything from BMW on this topic.

--Phil

>>>At least BMW have extended the srevice inteval for fluid change to 4 years in the centre circuits which keeps down the cost.<<<

From a UK BMW dealer, and my last service reflected the difference in cost.