BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

dirt,

Shotguns are only for defense? Mine is definitely not...

Personally, I (and almost every other person I've heard on this topic) say that shotguns are by FAR the most versatile firearm. There are so many choices of interchangeable barrel types and lengths plus various loads to choose from with shotguns. There is no other firearm that can effectively hunt all flying birds and small game. And also be effective with large game in close to moderate distances. Then there are things like trap and skeet shooting (IMO... more fun than anything else that can be done with a gun, of any kind). Myself, I find hand guns to be much more limited in usage.

Just goes to show...everyone's got an opinion...

It's also my opinion that the sound of the bolt slamming shut on a semi-auto shotgun is more frightening than the sound of a pump...

The fact that shotguns happen to be good for home defense is just superfluous icing on the cake. A feature that I've never once in my life used, and never had reason or occasion to think about using... ever. I just can't live like that. Either I've just been lucky, or my Labrador retriever(s) (past and present) must be doing a good enough job of keeping the bad people out of my unlocked house.

GRRR-ROOOOOOOF! ROOF! ROOF! GRRR-RRRR-RRRR-ROOF!

translated as

"Come on in! Welcome, I love it when strangers intrude in my space."

You can kill just about anything with a shotgun. From beanbags to slug loads they are indispensable.

Rob - congrats on the new pistol. Not much more fun than running a bunch of cheap .22 ammo through a pistol or rifle.

I will also recommend a future upgrade to the home defense arsenal. Shot placement is key in shooting anything but certainly more so with a .22. Of course, it is the favored round of the Mossad for taking out bad guys with stealth!

I also don't want to talk too much about what what is in the gun closet but lets just say, I can produce the referred to sound of a 12 gauge slide racking! There are 9s and 45s for backup and a couple of other items for the extreme zombie attacks!

But in all seriousness, I would recommend a good flashlight to be stored with the gun or next to the bed. One that can produce a blinding light on any intruder, not just your garden variety light. My kids gave me a nice one to replace my old Surefire. It think it is a Fenix model. Pretty cheap but puts out a great light!

As luck would have it I do have this powerful 3-Way, 1 million candlepower SpotLight stored 3 feet from the pistol. If it is dark I can close 1 eye and squint thru the other to hit the eyes of the intruder with the 55W halogen beam in my left hand. That totally "snow blinds" the perp, making for an easy target of the gun a half second after the pulsed-on 1 million candlepower light goes off. Gee, now I have another routine to practice!

BTW, I got that spotlight at Fry's Electronics about 3 years ago. Still works great, I just used the 7 Watt fluorescent part of it for 20 minutes 2 days ago. There's also a single white LED that will shine for days, useful if you're a camper or need a long lasting night light in a power outage. The Fry's in Milton, GA is frequently one of my 2 wheel riding destinations, even in winter.

When push-comes-to-shove the loaded pistol (with the safety OFF!!!) and the extra 10 round magazine in my left hand will be my 1st choice, especially if I get someone that immediately, blindly, starts shooting at the light!!

Join the NRA. We need you.

I will join the NRA 5 year plan tomorrow.

CycleRob wrote:I will join the NRA 5 year plan tomorrow.

Nice Rob!
I am so proud of you as you have come so far in the last few months.

Rode the bike to the shooting range again today after 3PM. It was bright sun, blue sky and 64F--68F (17.8C--20.0 C) for most of the 2+ hour total time for the 55 mile round trip commute and shooting session. I was just over 16 miles out (25.7km) before I realized the heated grips were turned off.

Once there, the shooting stall seats were about 80% occupied, surprising, considering the long 2 week stretch of a 6" snowstorm, near freezing rain and 10+ degreesF below normal temps. I shot 70 rounds 2 handed at my 10.5" x 7.5" (26.7cm x 19cm) square cereal box cardboard that was 2 wire rod staked at the 25 yard line (22.8M). It now has 17 holes in it. 1 shot hit the fat heavy wire stake and bent it good! The pistol's 3 white dot sights (2 rear wide, 1 front center) and my slightly jittery hands made all the other shots miss. Despite 2 empty shell casings jamming the side part way open, It was even more fun than the last shooting spree. The coldest temp on the bike's display was 64.7F. The electric vest was in the tail trunk on the way up, but I wore it on the way back. Totally toasty. I like being warm.

FYI, I gassed up the F800 after 30+ miles on the low fuel light and it took $9.73 of $2.999/Gal Chevron Regular. That's 3.244Gallons for the trip meter displayed 190.4 miles, a calculated 58.69MPG. The OBC Avg MPG said 60. That's pretty good considering the wide variety of riding speeds, several short warm-ups and idling in traffic during those miles.

So you had two cases stovepipe?
Time for the revolver.

While I have not owned a Walther, I find the 2 stovepipe rounds to be troubling. Walther used to be a quality piece of hardware. Unless that has changed (I doubt it), the ammo may still be suspect. You mentioned polishing the feed ramp and working on the slide. If you have done that, and the rounds are still not cycling properly, it maybe time to test a different ammo in it. Since you intend to use this weapon for home defense, I would bring in the target to about 7 or 8 yards. During use inside a house, the bad guys are likely to be within that distance, unless you live in a large home with long hallways. When you get better at killing cereal boxes and can tighten up that shot group, a steel target that resets itself would be a good training aid. The target is now about 3" and much harder to hit. As with everything in life, practice, practice, practice. You will get good enough to hit a 3" target at 10 yards. I'm sure your weapon is capable of doing it, now you just need to get enough practice in to accomplish it. If you have not seen the kind of target I am writing about, this link should help. http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/Vide ... 30&a=27910. These targets come in different sizes and styles. Have fun, plinking with a 22 can be a gas.

The most fun I have had lately with a .22 is instinctive shooting. Shooting from the hip(really just the waist). As you see the round contact you adjust, and it is a blast!

OK, I just got off the phone with a friend of mine who owns the same piece. He is also a gun smith. He bought the P22 for his adult son. I was reminded that I had in fact fired his weapon last year. I am told he has put hundreds of rounds through his without a hiccup. He suggests the same as I. Polish the feed ramp, work the slide looking for tight spots, also one other thing, sometimes the magazine will have the ears bent just enough to misfeed, but that doesn't seem to be your problem, since the round is feeding and firing, but hanging up when ejected. I'm betting it is the tight slide you mentioned earlier. Good excuse to buy some new gun tools

CycleRob wrote:... I shot 70 rounds 2 handed at my 10.5" x 7.5" (26.7cm x 19cm) square cereal box cardboard ...

Rob,

I get curious about the strangest things

Any particular reason for shooting 70 rounds this time and last?

22 ammo usually comes in a box of fifty.

jb

Okay, having shot a lot of .22 ammo in the past, 2 stovepipes in 70 shots on a new pistol, is nothing to be remotely worried about. .22 ammo is cheap, not manufactured to startling precision, and much more likely to have feeding and ejecting issues when compared to other rounds. Let the pistol get broken in first, then start looking at the quality of ammo you shoot (i would warn against blazer, as its dirty, and has historically had far more cycling issues than any other ammo I ever used), and if you STILL have multiple stovepipes (2% is not multiple, 5% and up is maybe noteworthy, 10% is unacceptable) then start looking at polishing feed ramps, check your extractor and extractor spring, make sure the slide doesn't bind (you want it to be tight, but not sticking), and think about getting a slightly lighter main spring (if it's got a hammer) or recoil spring (if its striker fired).

And please no one start the auto-loaders vs revolver argument in this thread; no one ever wins that discussion as both sides are determined that, despite any evidence, their choice is perfect, and all the others must therefore be worse.


If I didn't say this before: Congrats on the new toy, luckily you picked one that, should you become addicted to shooting, won't cost you an arm and a leg to feed (with four guns, and four different rounds, a trip to the range become expensive in a hurry). Oh, and here's for your assistance:

And please no one start the auto-loaders vs revolver argument in this thread; no one ever wins that discussion as both sides are determined that, despite any evidence, their choice is perfect, and all the others must therefore be worse.

I say buy both.

owldaddy wrote:

And please no one start the auto-loaders vs revolver argument in this thread; no one ever wins that discussion as both sides are determined that, despite any evidence, their choice is perfect, and all the others must therefore be worse.

I say buy both.

Good choice!

jb44 wrote:Any particular reason for shooting 70 rounds this time and last?
22 ammo usually comes in a box of fifty.

Right. I take 1 box of 50 and 2 preloaded 10 round magazines. The plastic honeycomb inside the 50 round boxes have been refilled from the 550 round loose bulk box. It fits nicely in the existing foam cut-outs of the case.

Yesterday (Sunday Jan 30) I went shooting again, only this time I took 2 boxes of 50 + 2 loaded magazines. Those 120 shots went pretty quick! Total shots fired before this session was 140. During the 120 shots it had 2 no loads and 2 stovepipes. That suggests either the ammo is weak or there's too much friction in the slide as it dingle the hammer. Maybe in addition to the pistol being new, I'm holding it too loosely?

BTW, the bike ride both ways was thru 64--68 DegF blue sky sunny weather, at a time when I see Chicago is having 20--29F and lots of snow!! I even took the longer/slower way back and it turned out to be much more therapeutic. What a difference the right State makes!

Tuesday (Feb 1) I'll give the Georgia Gun Store (where I got it) a heads-up on it's malfunctions after only 260 rounds fired. I'm expecting him to either blame the ammo, say they all do that when still new, or ask me to bring it in for an inspection. After that, depending on what happens, take it apart for the gun equivalent of a "port-n-polish".

Looks like you found a great source for information on your weapon. It isn't uncommon to have to do a little polishing here and there to get things moving freely. My Colt 1911 is a good example, it needed a massage to cycle properly also. Since a gun is just a machine, and your mechanically inclined, I'm sure you will get it cycling smoothly and without hanging up. As far as the ammo goes, next time your at the range, listen to the shot report. If the ammo is consistently making the same report, your probably ok. Bad or weak ammo sounds weak. It may make a loud report a few times, then have one that is weak or a squib. Bad ammo will sound different from one round to the next. Not consistent, which is what we look for in quality ammo. That is the very reason some Hunters or shooting competitors will make their own loads. AirForceDirt is correct in pointing out that 22 is very dirty burning. I don't wait to long to clean my weapon after shooting it. Doesn't matter which 22 ammo I am using, all of them will dirty up a pistol fast.

I say buy both.

+1

As to malfunctions - .22 ammo has a wide variety of bullets, power, quality etc. and my experience is that any .22 pistol or rifle will be finicky with certain brands.

Find one that works well in yours and make that one the 'go to' ammo. Use the less reliable ones for practice. Malfunctions during practice make for good practice in clearing malfunctions!

But the advice about tweaking the pistol is also good. Polishing the surfaces is always a way to ensure reliable feeding.

wncbmw wrote:Malfunctions during practice make for good practice in clearing malfunctions!

That has a really good Dr.M.L.King kind of ring to it. About the ammo suggestions, I have 50 rounds of another brand LR-HP with 38 grains to try (Federal LR-HP has 36).

After today I have a new appreciation for the hidden internal parts of my pistol. I took it completely apart today. There were 10 springs spread out all over the kitchen table besides all kinds of widgets and pins. I made 4 of the 5 mods documented in an On-Line P22 Bible PDF file and they really worked.

Here is a description of those mods:
1--Slightly changed the sharp edge contour of the hammer face edge to a larger radius. Polished with Semi-Chrome+Dremel felt cone. Filed hammer detent ~.002" to compensate for hammer face material removed.

2--Polished face of breach block that rubs on the hammer face after it is dingle on the way to full travel for shell ejection. These 2 mating parts make up most of the slide frictional slowdown.

3--Rounded, expanded and polished the trigger bar ears. Sanding them simultaneously on a cantilevered straight edge made them parallel and even, unlike the turned 90 degrees 1-at-a-time method the modification guide showed.

4--Dremel tool ground away the barrel opening's very tiny sharp edge that catches on some hollow point ammo. Such a very small change, but it visibly smoothed out the next round's glide path.

After cleaning and pivoting parts oiling, I very S-L-O-W-L-Y and C-A-R-E-F-U-L-L-Y putting it all back together. After hand cycling the slide, it not only was smoother sounding (quieter), it felt slicker. The noticeably felt slide return "detent pause" it had before . . . is now gone! Credit operations 1 & 2 for that. Someone spent a lot of time analyzing the very minor design and mass production flaws and came up with professional solutions that actually work. I quickly cycle ejected a full magazine of shells hand working the slide and it was marvelous. I swear I can hear the difference the mods have made. Can't wait to (legally) shoot it, when the weather improves (so I can take my bike for the 3rd time).