Hello from SoCal!

[Tom B]

Greetings all. I have been lurking and learning for a month or so since picking up an '07 R12R (black w/white pinstripe, ABS, OBC, sport screen, heated grips, center stand and side cases). It's a great bike, and in many ways quite a step up from my previous rides -- an '08 Ninja 250 (my training wheels) and an '09 V-Strom 650A. I'm still getting used to it, although after nearly 1,000 miles, I still find the handling a bit "quirky." The bike definitely seems to want a very smooth hand on the throttle during any transitions or maneuvers, but even with extra care and attention to being smooth, there still seems to be something a bit twitchy or squirrelly about it. Is this just the nature of the beast, something to do with the torquing of the boxer motor, or something to do with driveline lash through the shaft? I have the suspension set at the "medium" or default factory settings, as I am just about the weight mentioned in the MOM for the default setting. It's hard to figure out exactly what the bike is doing: sometimes it seems to want to fall into corners, and sometimes it seems to resist leaning and needs more shove on the low bar to get turned. Other times it kind of feels like the front and rear of the bike just aren't in synch, especially in mid-turn corrections (and yes, it's worse if I'm less than smooth with the throttle, but we're not generally talking ham-fisted throttle chopping here).

I'm thinking of trying new tires soon, although the Z6's aren't near the wear bars and don't appear to have worn unevenly. I don't know how many miles are on the tires, but the bike has about 6,700 miles on it. It's possible these are the original tires -- if so they look to have held up pretty well.

I'm not sure what else to look at. I did check the rear wheel play with the bike up on the centerstand, and it seems fine. Anything to check on the front?

Thanks in advance for any ideas on how to zero in on any potential handling issues, or for explanations of any unusual handling traits of a bike with the boxer/paralever/telever combo.

Cheers!
Tom B.

[TT RDHS]

Have you checked your tire pressure?
That can have a huge effect on handling...

P.S. Howdy and congrats on the new bike!!!
I'm sure you will grow to love it.

[deilenberger]

Also - I'd take the "medium" setting on the stock suspension with a grain of salt. You DO want to set the rear preload correctly.. having it wrong makes the ride uncomfortable, and changes the steering angle which can make the bike feel twitchy (especially if you have too much preload.) Tires can make a difference, but since the '07's didn't come with Z6's (Continentals or Michelins were stock) - I suspect they have been replaced. As was mentioned - tire pressure - set it by the label under the seat. Don't go by the usual shops advice to over-inflate the tires, comfort and handling will suffer.

[tobes]

Welcome! I'm in SoCal also. I've heard bad tires can do this. It took me a while to get used to the on/off throttle feel, especially in first gear. Now, 2 1/2 years later, it's not a problem - I still avoid 1st gear though. Hope you enjoy the bike as much as I have.

[Mollygrubber]

Welcome to the board! You'll find a wealth of help here...

I'm not trying to sound condescending here, so don't take it that way: how's your clutch/throttle control? I rode for many years before I truly figured out how to ride at low speed, and having imperfect clutch control with a motor this torquey makes for an uncertain feeling. The bikes you're used to are a little more forgiving in that respect.

During cornering, try to make sure to utilize the friction zone of the clutch and be really careful (ie. smooth) with the throttle, and you may find as you get more familiar with the bike that this problem goes away.

I'm still learning after 30-some years in the saddle, and in fact have signed up for another course in spring.

Enjoy the beast, it's a keeper!

Peter

[Tom B]

Thanks for the welcome and the tips! Tire pressures were set by the dealer on the high side -- 36F and 42R IIRC, or maybe 38F. I've been watching pressure and letting it drop slowly to see how it feels at the low end of the range.

Peter, you are right on target re: throttle and clutch control. One of my first realizations after a couple of rides on this bike was that I'm not nearly as good a rider as I thought I was! Throttle control that was good enough for the Ninja 250 (not a torque monster!) or Wee-Strom needs to be much more finely calibrated with the r12r. I guess part of what I'm finding is that this bike's lean and line seem to be very sensitive to changes in throttle input. I'm going back to fundamentals in learning to ride this bike (re-reading David Hough's "Proficient Motorcycling") and planning to take an ERC soon.

Don, I will experiment with the preload and see what that does. Do I understand correctly that preload, rather than damping adjustment, actually affects the steering/handling geometry?

Cheers!

[deilenberger]

Thanks for the welcome and the tips! Tire pressures were set by the dealer on the high side -- 36F and 42R IIRC, or maybe 38F. I've been watching pressure and letting it drop slowly to see how it feels at the low end of the range.

Try what BMW recommends (what could they possibly know?) - at 70F, 32F, 36R. (at 40F make it 31F, 35R)

Peter, you are right on target re: throttle and clutch control. One of my first realizations after a couple of rides on this bike was that I'm not nearly as good a rider as I thought I was! Throttle control that was good enough for the Ninja 250 (not a torque monster!) or Wee-Strom needs to be much more finely calibrated with the r12r. I guess part of what I'm finding is that this bike's lean and line seem to be very sensitive to changes in throttle input. I'm going back to fundamentals in learning to ride this bike (re-reading David Hough's "Proficient Motorcycling") and planning to take an ERC soon.

Don, I will experiment with the preload and see what that does. Do I understand correctly that preload, rather than damping adjustment, actually affects the steering/handling geometry?

Cheers!

Correct on that. If you want a brief tutorial on it..
http://www.eilenberger.net/Suspension/suspension.htm

Good luck!
Don

[Tom B]

Correct on that. If you want a brief tutorial on it..
http://www.eilenberger.net/Suspension/suspension.htm

Good luck!
Don

Great info -- time to start experimenting!

[NakedRider]

Tom, the tires seem to be a bit on the high side. Manual has them at 32F 36R but that by itself won't do it.

You are correct in that the BMW handles differently. The on-off throttle is a bit abrupt and that's not you, it just isn't as smooth as it should be.

I'm thinking the biggest handling difference that you have noticed is the telelever front end. It makes a HUGE difference in the way the bike behaves. Since the front doesn't dive much under braking there is also no corresponding "bounce back" when you release the brakes.

On my first BMW it took my quite some time to figure out why it was so different. Then you can use the attributes of the telelever to your advantage (like trail braking) if you prefer.

My advise is to just settle in with it and keep us posted. Chances are you'll get used to the quirks.

[Northernbiker]

Welcome Tom. I hope you are still enjoying the bike and learning from the experience of others here.
Coming from a f650CS, I also found the bike a bit quirky to ride at first. As others have pointed out, part of it was relearning clutch/throttle control for this bike. For sure the throttle was more sensitive than anything else I had ridden. The other part of it for me was getting used to a heavier bike with a different weight distribution. It took a month or two before my body automatically shifted the right way to balance, especially in slow, sharp turns.

Have fun in the sun there while the rest of us are waiting till spring to get our bikes out!

Chris

[tinytrains]

Congrats on the new R. That makes at least 3 of us in in So Cal. I have never seen another one on the road.

I went from a K75 to the R12 and it was a natural shift. Everything I liked about the K75 and MUCH more. The K still wins on smoothness. Since mine was new and I had to go easy for break-in, I suppose that gave me time to ease into the extra power, but I have found the handling to very predictable, and one of the easiest to ride bikes I have ever rode.

The only odd thing I notice, is that on a fast sweeper, rolling the throttle on or off will cause rear end to shift lines very slightly. No real change in line, but you can feel the twitch in your butt. I assume they all do that.

Scott

[deilenberger]

Congrats on the new R. That makes at least 3 of us in in So Cal. I have never seen another one on the road.

Strange - there are 3 R12R's in our small local club (85 members).. mine, Harry C's (he's on this forum - AKA mogu83) and the new guy who just got his white one. One black/white, one black, one white. We did kid the new guy (Greg) about the white pinstripes being hard to see on his bike..

[daveyator]

Hey there's 4 of us in SoCal! Congrats on the new bike. I have to go with the mfg tire pressure recommendation as mines been great there.

[Tom B]

I'm definitely enjoying the bike! As a novice rider (5,000 miles), I'm a bit surprised each time I ride a different bike at just how DIFFERENT they can be, even beyond the obvious or expected differences based on type. For example, I went to the BMW dealer to test the F800ST and the R. On paper, I thought the ST would be a slam dunk. Although I really liked the styling, uprightness and nakedness of the R, and the traditional boxer engine, I thought the ST would be more to my liking as my next step into a true modern sport touring bike (as well as more what I was willing to spend). I rode the ST first, and hated it. Just absolutely hated it and couldn't get back to the dealer's lot fast enough. As luck would have it, an '07 R had just been traded in on a K bike, so I took it for a spin and really liked it, although the handling seemed a bit odd sometimes. It turned out that the tires were low (about 26 lbs) and after the dealer added air, the handling seemed much better. The r12r is quite agile in swerves, and with decent clutch control and counterweighting can get around parking lots pretty comfortably. Where I find it a little unsettling sometimes is in medium- to higher-speed turns that wrap out of sight. The sideways engine torque definitely makes itself felt with a wobble when you get on (chassis rolls to the right) or off (chassis rolls to the left) the throttle. Maybe it's one of those things like riding in crosswinds, where if you just relax and let it go it's no big deal. I find the R much better in crosswinds than the V-Strom by the way -- just grip the tank, keep shoulders and elbows loose and stay light on the bars and the R does fine.

I haven't begun to figure out the telelever yet, except that the absence of brake dive is great! And yes, this bike doesn't seem to mind some light trail braking.

Anyway, I appreciate the welcomes and the tips, and hope to return the favor with some useful information, observations or experiences in the future.

Cheers!

[Coyote Crazy]

Hey there's 4 of us in SoCal! Congrats on the new bike.

Make that 5 of us. One thing is for sure we have a lot of nice roads to ride on around here in getting use to the handling of your R12R and nice year round weather as well. Welcome. I am running pilot road 2 and stick with the pressure settings listed on the label under the seat (36psi-38psi on the rear and 32psi to 34 psi on the front). These setting work well for me and handling is great on the twisties or slab'in it.

[tl440]

Welcome Tom. Me and another guy down in Fallbrook make at least 7 in Southern California, but there must be more or our five or so local dealerships would have had something other than white when I decided to buy my 09. It came with the z6s. and, at about 7500 miles, they seem to be holding up quite well. I recall having liked them on my 1150 as well.

As for riding, my experience may be opposite yours. I came off an FJR 1300 which weighs over 100 pounds more than the R12R. I had and R1100 and and 1150 prior to the FJR. Much as I enjoyed the FJ (over 60K miles), it was a real pleasure to get back on a lighter, sportier machine. I find I do Ortega, Palomar, Stunt, all our local favorites a lot more aggressively and confidently than I did them on the FJ.

Dave

[crazyhorse]

oh, there's more than that. i'm in pasadena and i know a guy named frederic is too...

wes

[Coyote Crazy]

I find I do Ortega, Palomar, Stunt, all our local favorites

Yea! Dave now you're talk'in some of my favorites. I have only been riding 2 1/2 years now and have a friend that rides a Japanese bike, been rinding for 40+ years and is amazed how quickly I was able to gain confendence on these roads with the R12R and am quite comfortable keeping up with him and a times "pushing" him. When I first started out I found it to be quite "twitchy" but with a little practice with throttle control it came around quite fast. Tom, I think you will find your R12R is an amazing handling bike in very short order.

[tinytrains]

Mike, it was good to run into you up above the Snake today and see another R12R and board member in person.

For those who don't live local, the Snake is the twisty bits of Mulholland Hwy above the Rock Store in Malibu.

Great day for a ride.

Scott

[tobes]

Mike, it was good to run into you up above the Snake today and see another R12R and board member in person.

For those who don't live local, the Snake is the twisty bits of Mulholland Hwy above the Rock Store in Malibu.

Great day for a ride.

Scott

Pleasure meeting you Scott. It was a beautiful day for a ride. After the snake we went to the Camarillo Aiport for lunch then circled back up PCH to home. Hope to see you up there again!

Pardon the crappy cell phone pic