Regional Sales Differences?

[enderw88]

Dealer here in Tucson doesn't have any R1200Rs in the showroom. He isn't planning on ordering any since he can't sell them when he does. Is this a regional thing, and they aren't moving here in AZ? I want to do a test ride back to back with an F800ST...

[ka5ysy]

Probably so.. It stands to reason that in great dual sport country like AZ, the roadster would not be in great demand, whereas the GS would be a big seller. Practically speaking, the RR can follow a GS most places, and I can testify to that fact, having done so on my RR. The RR would probably sell well in the north end of the state where the great mountain roads are. The only real disadvantages are the smaller diameter tires and that the RR cannot turn off the antilock brakes which can cause interesting times on a ride.

Our local dealership has had a number of RR's that have moved quickly, as have most other models including LT's. There is, or was, a Black with pinstripe 07 available in the Shreveport dealership several weeks ago you might check out if you are in a hurry.

Here is my take on the F800ST:

F800ST

Type

Water cooled twin cylinder 4 stroke

Displacement

798 cc

Bore X Stroke

82 mm x 75. mm

Horsepower

85 bhp @ 8000 rpm

Torque

63 lb/ft @ 5800 rpm

Valve Gear

DOHC, chain-driven with bucket tappets

No of cylinders

Two

Compression Ratio

12.0 :1

Engine Management

BMW Engine Controller - BMS K

Valves per Cylinder

4-Four

Valves

2 x 32 mm mm intake / 2 x 27,5 mm mm exhaust


This bike is a bright blue metallic, and quite striking. As noted it is a liquid cooled engine, so no cylinders hanging out in the wind.

The seating position is almost identical to the stock setup of the R1200R: slightly forward leaning and bar height that caused me to find some bar risers/setbacks. This bike caused me the exact pressure feeling in my wrists and lower back, so were I to purchase one, that would be an immediate modification of absolute necessity.

The seat height is very similar to the R1200R in that I can flatfoot this bike.

This bike's instrument cluster is very familiar to me: It is identical to the cluster on the R1200R, so I feel right at home. The display cycles just like my R12R, so nothing to learn now!

Pressing the starter button in the familiar BMW control setup, the engine designed by Austria's Rotax springs to life sounding much different than the Boxer engines, kinda like a Japanese bike. So I am ready to go: Very first impression is how fast the inline twin spools up. It is an absolute necessity to use the wrist down position on the throttle unless you want to float the front end!

Acceleration is nice, though compared to the Boxer's 109 HP and higher torque output, it is not quite as firm a push in the butt !. Roll-on in 6th gear is acceptable for acceleration, but again, if you have been on a Boxer engine machine, it is not as hard an acceleration without downshift to get the torque you need. Shifting is smooth and precise in all gears.

Running some twisties, I can say that the F800ST is a fine bike for this use. It feels much lighter than the other BMW's and flicks around into turns quite quickly. This will be a great machine as a street fighter, and can play with the crotch rocket crowd. Actually, you think you are on one of the UJM's as the sound and feel is similar.

The rear suspension preload is adjustable via an easily accessible knob on the right side of the bike slightly under the drivers butt, and the fuel tank is located there also, to contribute to mass centralization and the resulting fine handling. (somebody in Germany has been looking at the Erik Buell engineering handbook!) Remember, Rotax supplies the new liquid cooled engine for Buell too. Hmmmm...

Up to highway speed on I-10, nice fast acceleration to merge at Hwy 73 for a fast scoot back to Siegen. High speed cruise is nice and stable, at one point doing a pass up to 90 to get away from a tailgating joe sixpack idiot. Did that easily after a quick downshift to 5 and rolling on the gas. One minor annoyance I did notice is that the inline twin is buzzy. You can feel the high frequency buzz in your seat, which is not objectionable, but you can REALLY feel it in the handlebars; this will put your hands numb quickly. Obvious mandatory immediate upgrade is to purchase some heavy Throttlemeister's which will take care of that problem as it did in the R1200R, as well as give a cruise control feature the bike needs.

The seat is nice, although I only road it for about an hour, so I have no real opinion on the long haul rides.

The computer was showing consistent 60-65 MPG readout at this point, so the bike should get great gas mileage after a proper run-in period for the engine. At one point going south on Airline Hwy, the computer at 50 mph was showing 72 mpg!

Back into the lot at Hebert's and coffee, just in time to visit with some folks in looking at several of the consignment bikes, and pick up my R1200R for the run home.

Impressions:

The F800ST is a great bike properly positioned in the middle of the lineup of BMW Bikes. It is quite obviously aimed squarely at the Japanese bikes of Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki, and will be an definite asset to the BMW lineup. It is available with side cases, that give flexibility of doing some cruising with luggage.

It would make a very nice upgrade bike from someone who is just starting out riding, and wants something a little bit peppier than a thumper around 500cc. It is light enough to handle well as a step up bike, without the awsome power of a litre class machine. It is a very fine motorcycle.

[deilenberger]

I think the dealer is creating a self-fulfilling prophesy. You can't sell what you don't have.

The R1200R sells by test rides. Probably 90% of the owners on this forum came back from a test ride knowing they were going to buy one. They didn't necessarily go on the test ride knowing this - the test ride settled it for them.

If he doesn't have bikes/models to test ride - he isn't gonna sell them. He may well sell more GS's because people think they need one, and don't even bother with the test ride. If he had R12R's in stock - they'd sell.. I don't know of any dealers who threw them away due to old age and not selling. There were still a few '08's listed at a few dealers - but I think all those are now gone.

A BMW car dealer right around the corner from a BMW bike dealer has experienced a 20% increase in sales over the past month, when every other BMW car dealer has seen a decrease of about 15%. This car dealer is one who believes you have to have it to sell it - and he has an extensive inventory (one of the biggest in the US) of models/colors/accessories/trim-level in the US. The bike dealer - who recently had an open house - had no R12R's, no GS-A's, no F800's - and claims his sales are off, way off, and is blaming it on the economy. To tell the truth - I think his sales are off because he is tightening down with the economy and just doesn't have a bike to sell for a lot of potential customers.

Dunno about you - when I get the new bike urge (about every 32 years) - I want the new bike right now. I will buy it where I test rode it because they gave me the incentive to buy, and will likely make the deal before leaving the dealership. Same deal with cars (which I buy a lot more frequently). If I like the particular car, I'm leaving with it. If they don't have any I like - I'm just leaving.

I think your Tuscon dealer (Iron Horse?) is being shortsighted.. since he has none in the showroom - and claims he can't sell them - what did he do with the ones he had? Burn them?

I'd look for a different dealer.

[enderw88]

I asked him yesterday and he said he had two on the floor for several months and ultimately sold them at fire sale prices...Generally I like the dealership.

[ka5ysy]

I asked him yesterday and he said he had two on the floor for several months and ultimately sold them at fire sale prices...Generally I like the dealership.

Do they allow test riding? The only problem I can see might be that the store is located in the middle of town and it would take a 30-40 mile ride to get to a relatively open area to play. I agree that they have a nice store and mostly a lot of goodies.

[red baron]

In my opinion a big problem with the R1200R is the seat height. If a dealer orders a bike the bike either comes with a lower or standard
height seat and very seldom with the tall seat. Therefore when somebody wants to test drive the bike it most likely has the wrong seat height for him and immediately the test rider gets the wrong impression since no other height seat is available. Frankly if I had not driven this bike in Europe on a tour (with standard seat which was still too low for me), I would not have purchased this bike since the bike I test drove here had a low seat. In my opinion BMW either has to develop one seat with different heights or a dealer would have to keep in stock all heights which will not happen. Anyway this is my two cents worth why this model is not selling well despite being most likely the sleeper bike in the BMW line up.
Red Baron

[MikeCam]

Morton's BMW does keep a version of each seat available to equip their test ride bikes "on the fly". They've also started ordering/stocking/demo'ing low suspension along side normal suspension. Maybe it is a matter of which dealers pony up the additional effort?

I have observed, however, that Morton's put all their R1200R into the loaner fleet after the initial release and sales period. They never added any new stock all last season. Presently, there is one low suspension 1200R and over a dozen 1200GS in every flavor. It might be that in this market, the 1200R and 1200GS niches are close enough that price is not a final purchase factor.

[deilenberger]

Morton's BMW does keep a version of each seat available to equip their test ride bikes "on the fly". They've also started ordering/stocking/demo'ing low suspension along side normal suspension. Maybe it is a matter of which dealers pony up the additional effort?

I have observed, however, that Morton's put all their R1200R into the loaner fleet after the initial release and sales period. They never added any new stock all last season. Presently, there is one low suspension 1200R and over a dozen 1200GS in every flavor. It might be that in this market, the 1200R and 1200GS niches are close enough that price is not a final purchase factor.

I'm good friends with the GM (Steve A) at Morton's - I'll have to ask...

Morton's is known for being one of (it not the) best dealers in the US.. they do make the extra effort, and that's comes from the very top down (right from Jeff Massey..)

[enderw88]

I asked him yesterday and he said he had two on the floor for several months and ultimately sold them at fire sale prices...Generally I like the dealership.

Do they allow test riding? The only problem I can see might be that the store is located in the middle of town and it would take a 30-40 mile ride to get to a relatively open area to play. I agree that they have a nice store and mostly a lot of goodies.

I actually make a policy to never ride their or have my gear with me, because they so aggressively encourage test rides! I am too weak to not buy one on the spot. My K75 is the only bike I have ever owned, and I suspect the 25 years of technological advancement would render me completely susceptible to the salesman's hypnotic effects.

[ka5ysy]

[/quote]
I actually make a policy to never ride their or have my gear with me, because they so aggressively encourage test rides! I am too weak to not buy one on the spot. My K75 is the only bike I have ever owned, and I suspect the 25 years of technological advancement would render me completely susceptible to the salesman's hypnotic effects. [/quote]


That being the case, pay special attention to my signature line: I speak from experience

[Paul-from-VA]

Dunno about you - when I get the new bike urge (about every 32 years) - I want the new bike right now. I will buy it where I test rode it because they gave me the incentive to buy, and will likely make the deal before leaving the dealership. Same deal with cars (which I buy a lot more frequently). If I like the particular car, I'm leaving with it. If they don't have any I like - I'm just leaving.

I'm with you (except I seem to get the urge about every year), If I walk in, get a demo ride offer, like the bike (pretty easy) I can often find a creative way to support my lifelong motorcycle addiction.

[deilenberger]

I actually make a policy to never ride their or have my gear with me, because they so aggressively encourage test rides! I am too weak to not buy one on the spot. My K75 is the only bike I have ever owned, and I suspect the 25 years of technological advancement would render me completely susceptible to the salesman's hypnotic effects.

Eilenberger's Law #13: http://www.eilenberger.net/laws.htm - Never ride a bike you can't afford.

[celticus]

"My K75 is the only bike I have ever owned, and I suspect the 25 years of technological advancement would render me completely susceptible to the salesman's hypnotic effects."
The salesman could be trying to talk you OUT of buying the R1200R and it would not matter. It is the bike itself that would do the selling. When I first got my new R1200R I swapped (for a short ride) with a friend on a K75. They HAVE made some worthwhile advances in the last 25 years. Test ride one and set yourself free. It is your destiny..........

Mark

[builtforcomfort]

There are still a number of R1200Rs available directly from BMW. I just bought one through my dealer here in Rhode Island. They are even offering a $1250 rebate to help you make the decision. Forget about black. I got the last one. It's due to arrive any day and I feel like a kid waiting for Christmas. One test ride was all it took. I had already ridden an Aprilia Caponord ( they still have left over 06s & 07s) , Triumph Tiger, Moto Guzzi Norge and the Suzuki Bandit. They are all good bikes but I felt the RR stood out as the one that did everything the best. I've enjoyed reading some of your comments about the bike and it's helped me make decisions about how best to equip it. As soon as I get it I'll post a photo if I can figure out how

Mark