Potential problem

[hjsbmw]

Here is the image of the unpainted filler neck area on my 2011 model...Galvanized?
Should I paint it or leave it as it is?

Looks galvanized to me, as does the inside of the tank. The older ones are painted in both places.

I would not paint it, but would still install the rubber gasket. I had some rust that seems to have developed in the threaded holes, then spread slightly to the flat tank area. Unless they use stainless now for the threaded holes they could still rust. Be that as it may, I think rust prevention is fine, but preventing water from getting in in the first place is finer. Naturally, IMHO.

[deilenberger]

Doesn't look like the usual galvanized dipped finish (which actually has a flat crystaline pattern to it) - but I'd guess it has some rust treatment since I see no rust except a tiny bit in the left side drain.. If it was me, I'd be tempted to paint it with some Rustoleum.. (be interesting trying to tape it so the stuff doesn't get into the tank..)

[T206Bob]

Don & Harald,

Thanks for the suggestions guys.

Actually that is not rust in the left drain port, I had a very good look at it and it looks more like some type of sealer or glue used around the drain pipe attachment, whatever it is, it is not rust!
The drain/vent pipes look like a brass or bronze alloy of some type since they have that yellowish color.

I did fit the gasket as per the general consensus on this thread. The whole area got a good dose of ACF50 before re-assembly so I am hoping that, plus the gasket, will keep the O2 away from the Fe for a while!
In any case, now that we have all been alerted (thanks guys), this can become a recurrent maintenance inspection item, just like on the Cessna!

Bob.

[jafoca]

Great discussion... being new to the forum, this is outstanding information. I've yet to take delivery of my 2012, so I'll inspect this when I get it home... in 3 weeks? Gasket seems to be in order, but it does seem like an odd oversight by BMW.

I have a can of BoeShield (http://boeshield.com/) that I think is going to be used in this location (BTW - Peter, president of the company that packages/markets the product is a BMW owner - 4 wheeled ones - but he is an enthusiast..)

Deilenberger, thanks for the tip on BoeShield, looks like a great product. Have you ever used a product called CorrosionX? http://www.corrosionx.com
I've only used it on firearms but it has an impressive customer list (see major accounts tab). My understanding is that it is used extensively in the military on things that have extremely rapid rates of fire, so I guess it holds up well and in harsh conditions.

I work for Peter on the BoeShield T-9 website and noticed that you guys were discussing the product here. Peter wanted me to assure you that he is indeed a fan of the two-wheeled BMW's as well as the 4. Here are some pics of him with his two wheeled rides - the first of which he has had since the 70's!



Also - if you have any more questions on the product I can relay them to him. Boeshield uses an advanced formula developed by Boeing and can stand up to the toughest conditions.

[redwing]

Pulled the fuel cap and the red flange ..... I am numb at what I see.
Asked a dealer here in South Louisiana and the dealer said flatly BMW does not warranty against rust (some two weeks ago)... Called BMW North America and they called the dealer ...now I need to go back to the dealer to see if I have a warranty claim ....perhaps even a "goodwill" claim...98 miles one way.
One service manager (a different dealer) said BMW warranties against rust for the first year...is that right?
A new tank is about $1750.00 and 10% of the cost of the bike as someone mentioned earlier.

I think painting the rust with the chemical to change the rust into a metal is doable but what about the seam??? What can I do about the rust in the seam?
And the rubber gasket from the 1000RR is good but I need to address the rust.

Why has BMW not sent the owners a letter making the drain a maintenance issue?
Why did BMW change the 2011 gas tank to a different material?








This photo concerns me most .... there seems to be rust on the weld seam.

[Woland]

That's not pretty!

[deilenberger]

I'd use a rust-converter liquid - a POR coating made for covering rust. Before doing it pick any loose stuff out of the seam, and plug up all the holes (screw holes, drains, etc.) Tape around the recess REALLY carefully, and then cover the entire tank with newspaper. The POR stuff never ever is coming off.. (especially if you get it where you don't want it..) http://www.por15.com/ and http://www.por15.com/POR-15/productinfo/1GB/

They also make a fuel tank liner - but that's not needed since it is the outside of the tank that's rusted.

Looks like a $21 fix to me: http://www.eastwood.com/por-15-super-starter-kit.html - not worth dicking around with the dealer and BMW.. Then put the S1000RR gasket in and forgeddaboutit..

[redwing]

Don...If the POR does not come in contact with a part of the rust...like rust in the seam I can't get to or rust in the threads of the bolts holding the gas cap and flange .....will the rust be isolated?.... forgetaboutit .... it works that well??
I have been wanting to buy a dremel and now have a need.

Robert

[deilenberger]

Don...If the POR does not come in contact with a part of the rust...like rust in the seam I can't get to or rust in the threads of the bolts holding the gas cap and flange .....will the rust be isolated?.... forgetaboutit .... it works that well??
I have been wanting to buy a dremel and now have a need.

Robert

Robert - I think you want to at least expose the rust in the seam.. chip it back to solid paint (dental pick comes to mind..) and perhaps some use of the little metal brush that is available for a Dremel might be good.

As far as the threads- I wouldn't want to get the POR in them. They would probably need to be retapped afterwards. I'd seal them up with a very lightly greased golf-tee (the grease will keep paint from sticking to the Tee) when painting, then use silicone grease (not sealant) in the threads before reassembling (a Q-tip is what I'd use to apply it.) The silicone grease will exclude oxygen from the threads, and without oxygen - there is no way for something to rust.

It's easily (at least for me to say it..) fixable.. just gotta work out a plan. The tricky bit will be taping up the openings for the tank. You don't want the POR getting inside the tank...

[mogu83]

I cool way to seal a gas tank filler hole when painting the tank, applying sealer inside the tank, or whatever is to blow up a balloon in the hole. I didn't think of that, but I used the information to paint/seal more than one MC tank.

[hjsbmw]

Mine didn't look as bad as the one above. I scraped off the rust with a screwdriver. I closed the filler hole from the inside with a piece of plastic cut from a yogurt tub's lid, larger than the hole but with the same shape. I used wire through it and tied it above to a chop stick that I laid over the tank opening. I used a vacuum to get out the rust particles.

I applied brush-on rust converter to the rusted spots, a coat of brush-on Rustoleum, a top coat of clear nail enamel (fuel resistant to some degree), and cut an exact copy of the round tank base of thin buna-n (fuel resistant, fuel lines are made of it). I sealed the latter around the outside and the openings with black silicone. I then put grease into the screw holes and put the tank lid back on with the S1000RR gasket.

That's at least what worked for me. I checked after a very heavy rain, and it was bone dry in there. The buna-n step may not be necessary, but it made me feel better. You seem to have some extra work due to the rust in the seam. Just be careful to not chip any paint accidentally that's any higher than what the S1000RR gasket and tank lid will cover.

[redwing]

Tuesday or Wednesday I'll be getting new tires and will make a single attempt to get pictures in front of the regional service manager.

On the repair
Don...I thought maybe using bolts two or three inches long to plug the holes would be an option...using grease on the threads ...also the paint covered by the rubber gasket on the flange is still good so I'll leave that paint.
mogu83....Like the balloon idea but sleeved in an old t shirt so if it should pop I would catch the pieces....
hjsbmw ... what is black silicon?

thanks for the help / ideas... your opinions are welcomed

Robert

[hjsbmw]

hjsbmw ... what is black silicon?

aka high temp silicone as used for valve covers and stuff like that. There is no particular reason why I used it. I just had it laying around. I do think, however, that the black stuff is fuel resistant and the translucent household type is not.

BTW, yes, leave the portion of paint that was covered by the rubber gasket alone. It is good fuel resistant paint, and whatever you brush on probably can't compete in that area.

[redwing]

A thought I might have missed reading through the above postings so I wanted to mention it...

Washed the glue left from the tank decal and needed to dry the recess under the gas tank lid and flange. There was a puddle of water even though I got very little water on the gas tank... the drain is cr@p.
While I had the two parts out I noticed the holes the bolts went into collected water also.
The bolt holes are holes with a bottom... a bucket... a closed container the bolts go into...least the two I checked.... all disappointing.

Have ordered the gasket for the gas cap... have asked the dealer and BMW for a goodwill replacement... and I'll likely be doing a repair on the tank around Christmas...and will fill the bolt containers up with silicon grease as Don E. suggested.

Robert

[deilenberger]

Just a few updates..

What looks like galvanized isn't. It's raw steel. That REALLY sucks big time.

A good friend just got a 2011 R1200R that had been used by the dealer as a demo bike.. has about 4,000 miles on it. I'd suggested that he add the cap gasket based on our experience here. He got the gasket and rode over today to have me install it.

I was shocked what I found. The torx screws that hold the cap assembly were lightly rusted, and difficult to remove (they didn't just spin out..) When I removed the outer cap - the orange plastic part was fully revealed, and there was dried brown rust deposits around the outside of it. So - off came the orange part.

Unfortunately I didn't take a photo before I cleaned things up. I did take one after before reassembly. I'll post it when I get around to it. There was light surface rust on the entire bottom of the recess except where the gasket was. There were some signs of deeper rust in several places.

I cleaned it up using a rough towel and WD40 (since the tank was full I didn't want to try sandpaper..) The light surface rust was deposits from the deeper rust pits. After getting it as clean as I could - I used some BoeShield to spray on the exposed metal and pushed it around with my finger covering the entire surface (including under where the gasket will seat.) I cleaned the rubber gasket up and installed it on the bottom of the orange plastic funnel assembly. I then sprayed some BoeShield into each screw hole, filling them up. I next installed the plastic funnel assembly with the 3 screws that hold it (alone) to the tank assembly, and sprayed BoeShield (using a little red straw spray) into the recess between the funnel and the tank. I got about 1/8" of BoeShield floating around in the recess. When it dries it should form a decent protective layer. Keeping oxygen away from rust is the first step in preventing it's progression.

Next was the new cap gasket and the 4 screws that hold the metal part of the cap in place. ALL the screws required cleaning before reinstalling (surface rust on the threads) and this was done with a brass-brush.

I'm really disappointed with how this is done by BMW. It looks as if they went from bad (painted at least) to worse (bare steel.)

The bike in question as a demo probably did get washed regularly, and this dealership usually kept the demos outside during the day so it probably got it's share of rain. It didn't have a tankbag (which is the only reason I can think of why mine looked as good as it did.)

Hopefully the preventive/protective BoeShield will keep this from progressing. I'll take a look at it in the spring, and if the rust has continued I'd suggest my friend file a warranty claim with BMW for a new tank.

It's funny - when my friend was ordering the part - the parts guy wondered why we were using that part (from an S1000RR) on an R12R - he had no clue that there even was any problem. I think this is the same place that Harry C bought several of the rubber gaskets (one of which is on my bike..)

If you haven't done it - I'd REALLY suggest doing it. BMW dropped the ball on this big time.

[Matt]

I have been periodicly checking under the fuel filler for rust and noticed last week that rust is creeping in. The extra cover/gasket mentioned in this thread has been ordered and I applyed some rust coverter to the pitted metal, what is the best Rust-Oleum paint to use, enamel Rust-oleum is sold in the UK is that suitable ?

On closer inspection of the underside of the red filler, it appears that both drain pipes align with the two holes in the black rubber gasket. That would suggest that one drain will probably drain off any overfill of fuel and the other vent the tank. Neither of them will drain water pooled around the filler, water is sealed from the drains by that gasket, BMW were relying on water evaporating away. This is possible why the top cover/gasket was not fitted and with the top cover/gasket fitted, water could be forced past the cover/gasket when using a power washer etc and will then take much longer to evaporate when being sealed in with no ventalation.

So is fitting the cover/gasket I good idea.

[hjsbmw]

So is fitting the cover/gasket I good idea.

I still think so. It's easier to prevent getting close with your power washer than preventing rain to get close.

[Matt]

The cover gasket arrived so I will certainly try it and monitor the situation. I am a little concerned if water or moisture get in from condensation etc and it will become trapped with no ventilation, is this the reason for BMW not fitting the gasket.

[Snapping Twig]

I read this thread with disbelief, how could BMW overlook this when they have the gasket in their inventory already?!

My bike is new, bought it mid April, but I took it across California on a week long road trip in June and of course we had a rain day and we rode in it - schedules to keep and all that...

Besides that I've washed it a few times. I like S 100 and then a rinse, but I've used regular auto soap too, but I digress.

Called the local BMW dealer today and bought the gasket, the only one they had in stock BTW and I brought it home.

Tonight I took the silver bezel/lid off, balled up a blue paper shop towel and placed it in the fill opening and got out the compressor.

OMG!! Water and mung! Lots of water and mung.

Rust hadn't had enough time to set up, so it looked new inside. Continued to force air in the area around the orange plastic (which I left in place) until there was no more water, then changed tips on the hand piece to a needle type ball filler and continued the air drying until I was satisfied there was no more water.

I used a fogging oil - LPS 3 - which is excellent for this type of application. I use it to protect the electronic components of my salt water boat in the engine and everywhere else. It works!

Then I used the needle tip to blow the oil around inside the area and finally gave it another generous application all the way around with LPS 3.

The gasket is tailor made! Fit like a glove.

I told the counter guy at the BMW shop what I was doing with it and he thought it a good idea. Want to bet it makes it to the shop side?

Thanks for this timely tip. I did it early enough that if it works as I believe it will, rust is never going to be a problem in this location no matter how much water it's exposed to.

[deilenberger]

OMG!! Water and mung! Lots of water and mung.

The mung is from the car/bike wash. It gets in there and has no place to go.

I'll have to pull mine again sometime since I did actually wash the bike again and see how the gasket is working out.